91 Crankshaft Pulley photos for Reference - 13811-PR7-A02

[ffffanman]

Here is my 91 Nsx Crankshaft Pulley from my Nsx with 100,000 miles on it.
Part #13811-PR7-A02
Chris at SoS recommended changing it out with my Engine Refresh.
Story goes, these items have let go and have taken out the timing belt and you know what happens when the timing belt goes. So for peace of mind I changed it out.
Took it yesterday to my buddies sheet metal shop and sawed it in half on his big metal cutting band saw.
Enjoy the photos!
Trev

 

[ffffanman]

more pics!

 

[ffffanman]

more pics 2.

 

[VE7NSX]

I'd say replacing it was a wise decision

 

[ffffanman]

I can't see this item failing unless defective from the foundry.
But they have according to others.
If i would have seen these photos before, I would have not replaced it.
Trev

 

[goldNSX]

Thanks for the pics. I've heard of one case here in Switzerland where it nearly cracked. Lucky guy. :wink: Anyone else had this problem. Checkup after x miles recommended? So the TB has to go out for the change?

 

[NSXGMS]

Anyone else had this problem?

Yes.

Checkup after x miles recommended?

First, the crankshaft pulley is impossible to visually inspect to determine estimated lifespan. Second, even if it were inspectable it would have to be removed to inspect and at that point one might as well just replace it or install Dave's crankshaft pulley shield.

So the TB has to go out for the change

The timing belt must be removed to access the crankshaft pulley. That's why I think the general consensus is that the crankshaft pulley issue should be addressed at every 90K service interval.

Edit: the TB does not need removal to access the pulley.

One important thing to remember: the NSX being driven heavily on the track has not been confirmed to be the direct cause of this issue. It has only been consistent with the NSXs that have had the pulley failure.

My recommendation would be to replace the crankshaft pulley during the 90K service for heavily tracked NSXs and to also install Dave's crankshaft pulley shield. NSXs that have not been heavily tracked or driven hard should at least have the shield installed preventively at the time of the 90K service.

I personally will be having the shield installed on my pulley during my upcoming 90K service but since my NSX has less than 1000 track miles I will probably wait until the next 90K service to install a new pulley and of course reinstall the shield.

 

[goldNSX]

According to post no. 100 http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75746&page=2 the thing can be removed WITHOUT doing the TB or did I get something wrong?

 

[NSXGMS]

According to post no. 100 http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75746&page=2 the thing can be removed WITHOUT doing the TB or did I get something wrong?

You are absolutely correct. I misinterpreted a previous post.

The total labor for replacement of the pulley and/or installation of the shield should be about 1 hour, therefore it can be done at any time.

I suppose the 90K service interval can simply be considered a guideline as far as taking action regarding the pulley.

Post edited.

G

 

[sojusoulja]

my car just went into service for TB and WP..but after reading this I just had my mechanic do the pulley as well....he said he's heard of failures but said it wasn't common...either way its a good 200 piece of mind insurance i guess

 

[davidf]

You are absolutely correct. I misinterpreted a previous post.

The total labor for replacement of the pulley and/or installation of the shield should be about 1 hour, therefore it can be done at any time.

I suppose the 90K service interval can simply be considered a guideline as far as taking action regarding the pulley.

Post edited.

G

I'll be changing mine way before 90K. Those pics. make me very nervous.

 

[dan the man]

My cars on 86k

this whole thread makes me nervous, shes done over 20 laps of the ring

 

[NSXGMS]

My cars on 86k

this whole thread makes me nervous, shes done over 20 laps of the ring

There's no direct evidence that the failure is related to track time but I can tell you that I'll be adding Dave's pulley shield when my TB/WP service interval comes around. :wink:

 

[goldNSX]

There's no direct evidence that the failure is related to track time but I can tell you that I'll be adding Dave's pulley shield when my TB/WP service interval comes around. :wink:

Agree: It's not directly track-related. Primary reasons are (maybe in this order): 1. mileage 2. % of high-revs within the mileage 3. age 1+2 = miles driven in high-revs.

 

[Jimbo]

I disagree.

I believe the primary cause of failure is time. Elastomeric parts dry out and are subject to change over time. Sure, the more you run and rev your car the sooner it might fail, but there were numerous high-mileage, high track use NSXs prior to 2005 that were fine.

As our cars age we're seeing a number of failures that are primarily driven by time (i.e. leaky capacitors in climate control units). Hardened rubber inside a harmonic balancer is another example.

Change the balancer and install the shield at the same time. IMHO, of course.

:wink:


-Jim

 

[goldNSX]

Change the balancer and install the shield at the same time. IMHO, of course.

I disagree. :wink: The shield itself is sufficient enough. The failure has not happened very much or on every older car.

 

[Jimbo]

Gold,

I really can't see going thru the effort and time to remove the harmonic balancer on an older car in order to install the shield - and not bothering to install a new HB at the same time.

It makes no sense to me. If you could install the shield without removing the HB, I might agree with you.

-Jim

 

[Eclipsed]

I've spent an entire day trying to get this puppy off. 4 people and the bolt still wont budge.

 

[goldNSX]

Gold,

I really can't see going thru the effort and time to remove the harmonic balancer on an older car in order to install the shield - and not bothering to install a new HB at the same time.

It makes no sense to me. If you could install the shield without removing the HB, I might agree with you.

-Jim

It takes half an hour if you have the right tools.

I've spent an entire day trying to get this puppy off. 4 people and the bolt still wont budge.

What tools did you use?

 

[Eclipsed]

It takes half an hour if you have the right tools.


What tools did you use?

So far 80 gallon compressor at 140psi with an impact gun, no joy. Been underneath the car bracing the flywheel so the crank doesn't move at the same time. Tried 1/2" breaker bar, nothing will get this thing to move. I have a real bad feeling the shop that did my timing belt either used some serious loctite on the crankshaft bolt, or did something wrong when they reassembled. I'm getting the run around by the shop right now too when I called asking exactly what the did when the put it back together. This is day 3 trying to get the crankshaft pulley bolt out (had all the gear heads from the track come down to my garage to give it a go, they all agree that something is wrong, they never have problems getting that bolt out on their nsx's). I went ahead and just cut the timing belt cover off and am reassembling at the moment. Got the motor degree'd in. Letting the hondabond dry at the moment. Will cross fingers and hope everything is okay when I fire her up. Either way the car is being trailored over to fusionworks this week so ray can get his hands on the car and fix this.

I'm very disappointed with FTW Motor sports, which is very sad considering the owner is a long time friend of mine.

 

[goldNSX]

So far 80 gallon compressor at 140psi with an impact gun, no joy.

We had the problem once and it was related to the extension we first used. After removing the extension it broke free.

There exists one more trick but I'm not sure if it's a safe way. Maybe Larry or others can comment this method. I don't feel comfortable with it but this is how it goes:
Place the Honda crankshaft tool ultra-safely, it has to take the Gorilla torque while you start the engine for only a fraction of a second then turn it off immediately. Maybe you can even put more torque on it if you use an impact gun at the same time. It does involve starting the engine for a second or so while using an impact gun at the same time. That's what a mechanic told me they did on Legends. I don't know if the bearings like it.

BEFORE going this was please ask others mechanics (I'm no mechanic)

 

[greenberet]

For reference, the crankshaft pulley I assume Honda installed on my NSX at the factory and the new one I just had installed with the part number 13811-PR7-A02 both look the same and they look different than what ffffanman posted above. ffffanman’s looks sturdier.

In both my old and new crankshaft pulleys, the rubber dampener “donut” inside is attached to the flat face of the pulley that you can see from the wheel well. There’s a gap between the dampener and the outer metal surface that holds the belts and the inner metal surface around the splines. You can see the sunlight shining down into those open channels in the pictures below. The dampener inside the pulley ffffanman sawed in half, on the other hand, is attached to the inner surface that goes over the splines, not to the flat side that faces the wheel well.

I don’t know why they’re different, but they are. Also, both my pulleys have twelve little holes on the flat side facing the wheel well that are filled with rubber (securing the rubber dampener to the metal pulley) while ffffanman’s has eight much bigger holes on the flat side that aren’t filled with rubber (since the dampener is secured to the pulley in a different place). The dampener in my pulley is mainly rubber with just a ring of metal on the side facing the engine and ffffanman’s is mainly metal with just a tube of rubber inside. ffffanman's also looks like it stands off further from the engine than mine, which might change the belt geometry.

In any case, the pulley ffffanman sawed in half looks like it would last longer than the pulley that just failed in my car.

ffffanman - does the new pulley on your car with the part number 13811-PR7-A02 look like the sturdy old one you sawed in half or more like mine?

Pictures of my old and new pulleys are below, here , and here.

 

[goldNSX]

I've also installed version A02. Honda redesigned it two times I guess, from A00 to A01, then A02. Maybe automatic engines have a different one. Not sure.

ffffanman's one looks very different than the one I took off my car. The one I've installed looked the same as the one I've taken off.
I'm interested what ffffanman installed on his car.

 

[ffffanman]

i would go take pictures right now but its raining.
Chris at SOS installed the new one.
Hey, maybe i have a photo some where.
BRB
Trev