What would you guys do first: exahust or a chip? I haven't seen much talk about performance chips on this sight. Is the NSX compatible with them?
Which mods first?
- Thread starter naaman
- Start date
You've said you're not planning on getting an NSX for a long time. Wait until you get the car, and live with it for a while as it is, before you start considering mods.
There are chips. Look in the FAQ.
[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 03 August 2002).]
Greets Naaman, well its kinda to each their own as to what they mod first.some like there cars bone stock and are proud of it others mod as much as there wallet can handle.that would be me.
also it depends what year.the newer NSX i think 95 or 96 and up come with headers.mine is a 91.if you have an older car.in my opinion in this order:
1.intake there are many to choose from and cost from not much to way to much
I choose to just get a drop in high flow k&n air filter for the oem airbox.the oem air box is cold air intake it draws the air from outside the engine bay which can get pretty hot and if you go with a high flow after market intake that draws air from inside the engine bay its not so good.which ever you choose dont believe the hp gains I think about 3 hp is about right btw my high flow replacement filter cost 50 bucks
then I would do headers and exhaust in that order but better if you can do at same time.
everyone had a different opinion as what combo is best. I went with dc sport headers
1000 on dali site and rm exhaust from rm racing duel tip looks great expect to pay 1000 for the headers if you get em from dali and 1300 for the exhaust from rm.it is VERY loud.another popular exhaust is the wide range of taitec exhaust offered by cris at science of speed and cybernation
if you want real loud exhaust you can put on straight pipes and remove the cats. taitecs pipes are found also at sos and cyber I prefer to purchase from sos.you wont see any hp gains from this mod imo but just louder if thats your thing(note: all the taitec stuff incurs a import fee that gets past on to you and is not the vendors trying to make more money.I hear the taitec exhaust can be had for as cheap as 799 shop around'
as for chips
dali sells one and from what I hear is pretty good and he posts dynos of his chip against gains from other makers.
do you homework on what sound you want compare prices and buy what you want not what me or someone else thinks is right for you.you are the one who will have to live with your new super duper loud exhaust after you get it so be sure.
short gears and ring and pinion would be next on my list then a turbo..supercharger or nitrous..if you go the nos route have a competent person do the install and no matter if you go wet shot or dry I would not spray more then 100 shot on stock motor.berfore install have your fuel system checked out to insure it can handle the nos setup.and have you injectors checked too and your fuel filter replaced.
you see this list could go on and on.
intake headers exhaust are where most begin but IM WARNING YOU..this can become addictive and you can sink alot of cash into mods.body kits , racing seats so on.also just my opinion dont mod anything that cant be un modded if you are in a position that could force the sale of the car unexpectedly.most people want to by un modded as they feel the mod car was probably beat on or raced.so save all the parts you take off is a good idea so you can put her back to stock for sale.
hope this helped.I skipped over dozens of common mods but you will as you continue your homework decide what you want.I want to take one thing back.your first purchase should be the service manual for your year car.read it first then decide.and remember these ARE my opinions, lots of people have all the mods I discussed and none are from the same maker of mine.
best regards David
ps list of sites for mods
Daliracing
Science of speed
comptech
cybernation
acr motor sports
billet design
to name a few
also it depends what year.the newer NSX i think 95 or 96 and up come with headers.mine is a 91.if you have an older car.in my opinion in this order:
1.intake there are many to choose from and cost from not much to way to much
I choose to just get a drop in high flow k&n air filter for the oem airbox.the oem air box is cold air intake it draws the air from outside the engine bay which can get pretty hot and if you go with a high flow after market intake that draws air from inside the engine bay its not so good.which ever you choose dont believe the hp gains I think about 3 hp is about right btw my high flow replacement filter cost 50 bucks
then I would do headers and exhaust in that order but better if you can do at same time.
everyone had a different opinion as what combo is best. I went with dc sport headers
1000 on dali site and rm exhaust from rm racing duel tip looks great expect to pay 1000 for the headers if you get em from dali and 1300 for the exhaust from rm.it is VERY loud.another popular exhaust is the wide range of taitec exhaust offered by cris at science of speed and cybernation
if you want real loud exhaust you can put on straight pipes and remove the cats. taitecs pipes are found also at sos and cyber I prefer to purchase from sos.you wont see any hp gains from this mod imo but just louder if thats your thing(note: all the taitec stuff incurs a import fee that gets past on to you and is not the vendors trying to make more money.I hear the taitec exhaust can be had for as cheap as 799 shop around'
as for chips
dali sells one and from what I hear is pretty good and he posts dynos of his chip against gains from other makers.
do you homework on what sound you want compare prices and buy what you want not what me or someone else thinks is right for you.you are the one who will have to live with your new super duper loud exhaust after you get it so be sure.
short gears and ring and pinion would be next on my list then a turbo..supercharger or nitrous..if you go the nos route have a competent person do the install and no matter if you go wet shot or dry I would not spray more then 100 shot on stock motor.berfore install have your fuel system checked out to insure it can handle the nos setup.and have you injectors checked too and your fuel filter replaced.
you see this list could go on and on.
intake headers exhaust are where most begin but IM WARNING YOU..this can become addictive and you can sink alot of cash into mods.body kits , racing seats so on.also just my opinion dont mod anything that cant be un modded if you are in a position that could force the sale of the car unexpectedly.most people want to by un modded as they feel the mod car was probably beat on or raced.so save all the parts you take off is a good idea so you can put her back to stock for sale.
hope this helped.I skipped over dozens of common mods but you will as you continue your homework decide what you want.I want to take one thing back.your first purchase should be the service manual for your year car.read it first then decide.and remember these ARE my opinions, lots of people have all the mods I discussed and none are from the same maker of mine.
best regards David
ps list of sites for mods
Daliracing
Science of speed
comptech
cybernation
acr motor sports
billet design
to name a few
nsxtasy posted while I was writing mine.I was assuming you had one already.follow his advise and drive your car un modded for a period of time.you may find she is perfect bone stock and your wallet will love you for it.
david
Now THAT'S the kind of response I haven't gotten in a long time.
nsxtasy, you actually remember who posts what? I feel like people know each other around here, but I always felt like a third wheel. Thanks for the attention.
BadCarma, thanks for the in depth response. I appreciate the time you spent helping me out.
Actually, if I were going to buy one, then, yes, it would take me forever to save up for it, something happened recently that gives me the idea that I MIGHT be getting one sometime soon (I don't want to jynx it, so I don't talk about it).
My friend and I are taking a bunch of autoshop and performance technology classes at the community college in Santa Monica and we are going to start doing custom mods for people.
Also, for my own car, I don't really care about high end speed as much as low end torque. I will search the FAQ, but are there any personal prefs as to any NA upgrades to get the most possible low end acceleration?
nsxtasy, you actually remember who posts what? I feel like people know each other around here, but I always felt like a third wheel. Thanks for the attention.
BadCarma, thanks for the in depth response. I appreciate the time you spent helping me out.
Actually, if I were going to buy one, then, yes, it would take me forever to save up for it, something happened recently that gives me the idea that I MIGHT be getting one sometime soon (I don't want to jynx it, so I don't talk about it).
My friend and I are taking a bunch of autoshop and performance technology classes at the community college in Santa Monica and we are going to start doing custom mods for people.
Also, for my own car, I don't really care about high end speed as much as low end torque. I will search the FAQ, but are there any personal prefs as to any NA upgrades to get the most possible low end acceleration?
if you want torque, you're considering buying about the worst performance vehicle on the planet for producing it 
. if you already want an NSX hopefully you're already very familiar with its plusses and minuses (which are far outweighed by its plusses, but torque is over in the minus column
).
. if you already want an NSX hopefully you're already very familiar with its plusses and minuses (which are far outweighed by its plusses, but torque is over in the minus column
That's why I want to modify it. I think I know about as much as one can know about the car without actually having driven it.
I want the car becaue it is a Honda, because it looks cooler than any car I've ever seen (it actually looks like a car, unlike some of those european exotics), it has (supposedly) the best handling (which scores it lots and lots of points with me)... pretty much everything I've ever read about the car I like.
I want the car becaue it is a Honda, because it looks cooler than any car I've ever seen (it actually looks like a car, unlike some of those european exotics), it has (supposedly) the best handling (which scores it lots and lots of points with me)... pretty much everything I've ever read about the car I like.
I have to agree with nsxtasy. Live with the car for a while. Personnaly, I took the direction of making ME faster before I attempted to make the car faster. I would suggest enrolling in at least one high performance driving or racing school before doing anything to the car. I remember hearing someone say, "learn to throw it around, not throught it away" Darcon
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[This message has been edited by darcon (edited 03 August 2002).]
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[This message has been edited by darcon (edited 03 August 2002).]
- Joined
- 14 April 2002
- Messages
- 2,273
A lot of mods depend on what you are looking for.
For looks - new wheels or exhaust, for performance - headers & chip are cost effective, for handling - sway bars can't be beat.
Here are the mods I have done and I am very happy with them. For price, quality, and performance - visit www.daliracing.com and you will find just about everything you are looking for. I am also very happy with the purchases I have made from CGI Motorsports as Phil is a real pro. CGI is also a great place to mod-yourself at one of their driving schools! CompTech has good products but the price/performance ratio goes down IMO. Good luck...
Here is the list of mods now on the NSX:
Looks:
- Forgeline wheels (same Forgelines as the Cart pace car)
- Dali SmartTenna
- Dali Strut Bar
- Tinted rear window over engine
- Calipers painted red
- Coolant tank painted dark gray
- Dali Camera / Radar mount
- Dali Front License Plate Bracket
- Taitec Drilled Pedals
- Dali AL Shift Knob
Performance:
- Comptech SS 304 Headers
- Comptech SS 304 4" resonated exhaust
- K&N Filter
- Dali Chip
- Dali 7lb Black Panther Battery/Mount
- Removed Engine cover/Spare/Phone/Trunk Mat/Tools
Safety/Misc:
- Dali Harness Bar W Schroth 4" 6pt harness
- Dali Smart Shift
- Dali Stone Shield
- Dali Fire Mount
- SpeedBleeder clutch valve
- Dali Window Things
- Dali cup holder
Handling:
- Eibach springs
- Bilstein Monotube shocks
- Al Terpak Sway Bar Collars
- Dali street / race Sway Bars
Braking:
- Dali Brembo drilled and slotted rottors
- Dali SS / Kevlar Brake Lines
- Dali brake ducts
- RM Racing Pads
- SuperBlue ATE brake fluid
- SpeedBleeder brake valves.
------------------
Nick M
91' Red/Black with Many Mods
99' Honda Odyssey with Many Kids
For looks - new wheels or exhaust, for performance - headers & chip are cost effective, for handling - sway bars can't be beat.
Here are the mods I have done and I am very happy with them. For price, quality, and performance - visit www.daliracing.com and you will find just about everything you are looking for. I am also very happy with the purchases I have made from CGI Motorsports as Phil is a real pro. CGI is also a great place to mod-yourself at one of their driving schools! CompTech has good products but the price/performance ratio goes down IMO. Good luck...
Here is the list of mods now on the NSX:
Looks:
- Forgeline wheels (same Forgelines as the Cart pace car)
- Dali SmartTenna
- Dali Strut Bar
- Tinted rear window over engine
- Calipers painted red
- Coolant tank painted dark gray
- Dali Camera / Radar mount
- Dali Front License Plate Bracket
- Taitec Drilled Pedals
- Dali AL Shift Knob
Performance:
- Comptech SS 304 Headers
- Comptech SS 304 4" resonated exhaust
- K&N Filter
- Dali Chip
- Dali 7lb Black Panther Battery/Mount
- Removed Engine cover/Spare/Phone/Trunk Mat/Tools
Safety/Misc:
- Dali Harness Bar W Schroth 4" 6pt harness
- Dali Smart Shift
- Dali Stone Shield
- Dali Fire Mount
- SpeedBleeder clutch valve
- Dali Window Things
- Dali cup holder
Handling:
- Eibach springs
- Bilstein Monotube shocks
- Al Terpak Sway Bar Collars
- Dali street / race Sway Bars
Braking:
- Dali Brembo drilled and slotted rottors
- Dali SS / Kevlar Brake Lines
- Dali brake ducts
- RM Racing Pads
- SuperBlue ATE brake fluid
- SpeedBleeder brake valves.
------------------
Nick M
91' Red/Black with Many Mods
99' Honda Odyssey with Many Kids
Number9
Guest
- Joined
- 25 November 2000
- Messages
- 704
Assuming you've got an early model coupe and everything has been properly maintained, I'd suggest the following in no particular order:
CT Front Brembos
94+ wheels/tires
CT headers
Boost (Basch/CT/GruppeM/Larry/Gerry/whatever)
CT non-compliance beam/toe-links
Great stuff, empirically determined...
CT Front Brembos
94+ wheels/tires
CT headers
Boost (Basch/CT/GruppeM/Larry/Gerry/whatever)
CT non-compliance beam/toe-links
Great stuff, empirically determined...
Originally posted by robr:
if you want torque, you're considering buying about the worst performance vehicle on the planet for producing it).
I think you need to understand what makes a car accelerate, and why torque does not tell the whole story.
The force that makes a car accelerate is torque at the wheels, which equals engine torque (the number that's usually quoted in specs), less drivetrain losses, times gearing. While the engine torque of the NSX is not particularly impressive at 210 ft-lb for the early cars (224 for the later ones), they still accelerate quite rapidly. That's mostly because any disadvantage in torque is compensated by a distinct advantage in gearing. (Drivetrain losses for the NSX tend to be pretty darn low too, at around 11 percent.)
The variable valve timing in the NSX allows the torque curve to stay flat; as revs rise, the extra cam lobe kicks in, so there is plenty of torque all the way up close to that VERY high redline. The NSX can maintain torque while revving higher than other cars in which torque drops off at lower revs. The NSX stock five-speed goes to 40 mph in first gear and 81 mph in second. Thus, the NSX tends to be in lower gears at speeds where conventional cars have already upshifted and lost the advantage to the NSX in gearing. Because horsepower is a reflection of this gearing advantage (horsepower is a product of torque and revs), horsepower is a far better measure of the acceleration ability of the NSX than torque is.
There's a more extensive description of this phenomenon in the article here.
If you are wanting performance and not really show:
1. Buy solid NSX
2. Put your money into driving lessons and track time as opposed to mods.
3. Show up at events and out run heavily moded cars with more hp, bigger brakes, moded suspensions and the like (like mine) with a stock car b/c u can drive like a mofo (unlike me).
4. Smile
5. If you must do mods do the ones that help while braking, accellerating, and cornering. That would be tires and weight reduction. Tires cost a little. Weight mods are free until u start buying lightweight replacement parts.
6. Move on to the brakes next.
7. Do exhaust and stuff later. Chip last... when u finally know what you are doing with the car. U might think u want nos and buy a compatible chip and end up wanting a sc and needing a newer chip.
Thats what I would do if I did it all over again.
Here is what I did:
1. Bought solid NSX with tons of mods.
2. I still can't drive... despite the fact that I have a beefy NSX. Anyone can hit wot in an NSX. Not everyone can take the car to its potential.
You see my point. Now I am doing what I can to learn how to drive.
1. Buy solid NSX
2. Put your money into driving lessons and track time as opposed to mods.
3. Show up at events and out run heavily moded cars with more hp, bigger brakes, moded suspensions and the like (like mine) with a stock car b/c u can drive like a mofo (unlike me).
4. Smile
5. If you must do mods do the ones that help while braking, accellerating, and cornering. That would be tires and weight reduction. Tires cost a little. Weight mods are free until u start buying lightweight replacement parts.
6. Move on to the brakes next.
7. Do exhaust and stuff later. Chip last... when u finally know what you are doing with the car. U might think u want nos and buy a compatible chip and end up wanting a sc and needing a newer chip.
Thats what I would do if I did it all over again.
Here is what I did:
1. Bought solid NSX with tons of mods.
2. I still can't drive... despite the fact that I have a beefy NSX. Anyone can hit wot in an NSX. Not everyone can take the car to its potential.
You see my point. Now I am doing what I can to learn how to drive.
one other thing....
i am loving lessons...
especially when i see them pay off.
like when u learn how to take a stock $800 1988 crxsi with messed up brakes and suspension that was a parts car and out run a brand spanking new sc s2000. just shows my point that a non-experienced driver can make a fast car slow. also for the record the sc s2000 is leraning how to drive and his lap times and getting alot better. so no disrespect here from me to either the car or the driver. its just that i started lessons before he did.its goes to show though that driver skills pay off and they are mods that can be taken from your nsx to any other car u will ever own. thats worth it right there. driver mods do not lose value over time. really only when the driver is heavily moded will a heavily moded car perform as it can and should.
i am loving lessons...
especially when i see them pay off.
like when u learn how to take a stock $800 1988 crxsi with messed up brakes and suspension that was a parts car and out run a brand spanking new sc s2000. just shows my point that a non-experienced driver can make a fast car slow. also for the record the sc s2000 is leraning how to drive and his lap times and getting alot better. so no disrespect here from me to either the car or the driver. its just that i started lessons before he did.its goes to show though that driver skills pay off and they are mods that can be taken from your nsx to any other car u will ever own. thats worth it right there. driver mods do not lose value over time. really only when the driver is heavily moded will a heavily moded car perform as it can and should.
I feel so ignorant. Let's see if I understand:
The lower the rpms, the less actual work the engine is doing over time and acceleration is directly affected by this.
Regardless of torque, the more rpms (or is it "the closer to the power peak"?), the more work the engine is doing over time, and thus, the faster the acceleration.
So even if an engine is strong (gobs of torque), if it is pulling slow (low rpms), it is not exerting all of it's potential energy (horsepower) to pull the car, and thus slow acceleration.
Generally speaking the more rpms, the more horsepower, up until the power peak, which is where the torque drops low enough for the power to also suffer.
Horsepower climbs even after torque begins to drop because the effort of the engine (rpms) increases faster than the strength (torque) decreases...?
The lower the rpms, the less actual work the engine is doing over time and acceleration is directly affected by this.
Regardless of torque, the more rpms (or is it "the closer to the power peak"?), the more work the engine is doing over time, and thus, the faster the acceleration.
So even if an engine is strong (gobs of torque), if it is pulling slow (low rpms), it is not exerting all of it's potential energy (horsepower) to pull the car, and thus slow acceleration.
Generally speaking the more rpms, the more horsepower, up until the power peak, which is where the torque drops low enough for the power to also suffer.
Horsepower climbs even after torque begins to drop because the effort of the engine (rpms) increases faster than the strength (torque) decreases...?
Very well stated, td2k_nsx.
I think td2k_nsx is right on target...100%.
Forget about the torque/horsepower thing and concentrate on learning how to drive the car.
I think td2k_nsx is right on target...100%.
Forget about the torque/horsepower thing and concentrate on learning how to drive the car.
Can anyone confirm this for me?
Yes, the less work the engine is doing over time.
Acceleration is directly affected if the engine can put out the same torque at higher RPMs, so that it can have a gearing advantage.
Acceleration isn't a function of the RPMs themselves, but of gearing. But no, it's not regardless of torque; it's assuming torque is the same in either case.
Again, it depends on where the torque occurs. If torque occurs up high in the rev band, the engine can be in a lower gear, which is a gearing advantage over an engine which makes the same torque only low in the rev band.
Yes. With the NSX and other VTEC cars, power increases almost all the way to redline:
Because the torque isn't dropping by all that much above the power peak, you can maximize acceleration by going all the way to redline before shifting. This gives you a gearing advantage over cars in which torque drops faster and at lower revs.
Yes.
nsxtacy, can I email you a few more questions?
Certainly.
You have mail.
You have mail.
I would agree with the suggestions regarding modifying yourself first. I went through Skip Barber's 3 day school before buying my NSX three years ago and immediately enrolled in their 2 day advanced school before trying anything "fancy" like tracking my NSX.
I then joined the NSXCA and my first event was the NSXPO last year. I learned more about my car during that week than I probably would have on my own over a much longer period of time. Since then, I have done track events at several locations with the SCDA and Trackmasters and have gained more confidence in my abilities to handle the NSX. The car is still as stock as it was when it left the factory in 1996 (except for 5 point harness belts) and it will pass many modified NSX's on the track driven by people who haven't learned the basics of actually driving the car in the first place.
A little driver's education goes a long way and will probably result in you enjoying your car much more than spending a lot of money on mods and not understanding the dynamics of performance driving.
Bob
I then joined the NSXCA and my first event was the NSXPO last year. I learned more about my car during that week than I probably would have on my own over a much longer period of time. Since then, I have done track events at several locations with the SCDA and Trackmasters and have gained more confidence in my abilities to handle the NSX. The car is still as stock as it was when it left the factory in 1996 (except for 5 point harness belts) and it will pass many modified NSX's on the track driven by people who haven't learned the basics of actually driving the car in the first place.
A little driver's education goes a long way and will probably result in you enjoying your car much more than spending a lot of money on mods and not understanding the dynamics of performance driving.
Bob
hey, as a follow up:
i daily drive a cadillac esclade; i have more, much more torque than an nsx, and i have more horsepower than an nsx.
DO you want to dragrace me and will i win????
not a very good comparison, but look at sports cars that on paper should smoke the nsx, such as a dodge viper, and the margin of lead is much smaller than it should be.\
the balance of the car in question, weight, gearing, and horsepower can overcome cars which are heavy in one category and light in others.
i daily drive a cadillac esclade; i have more, much more torque than an nsx, and i have more horsepower than an nsx.
DO you want to dragrace me and will i win????
not a very good comparison, but look at sports cars that on paper should smoke the nsx, such as a dodge viper, and the margin of lead is much smaller than it should be.\
the balance of the car in question, weight, gearing, and horsepower can overcome cars which are heavy in one category and light in others.
