Timing of oil change before storing for winter?

[cjeezy]

Hi,

Living in OH means I need to store the NSX for the winter...and who know when the temps will change and the snow will come here!

My quesions are:
1. I know it's best to have a fresh oil change before storing, but how fresh? For example, if I got one now and then stored in November (assume 1K miles/mo.). Will the oil not be fresh enough (I do not track it). Or, should I wait another month or so and then get it done?
2.Similar question...if there are a few nice days mid-winter, can I get the car out, or should I leave it hiberate in the garage with the fresh oil?

 

[drmanny3]

You need to adhere to the requirements for oil changes. Rarely do any of our cars hit the mileage requirement. So often the time limit of 12 months comes into play. I would recommend that you change prior to storing your car. Even if you take it out several times, no big deal. Just make sure you bring the engine up to temperature before shutting it down and placing the car back into storage. The problem is if you just start the car the oil will not get hot enough to drive off the moisture. Remaining moisture can react with contaminates and form acids. Acids are bad for metals.

 

[cjeezy]

You need to adhere to the requirements for oil changes. Rarely do any of our cars hit the mileage requirement. So often the time limit of 12 months comes into play. I would recommend that you change prior to storing your car. Even if you take it out several times, no big deal. Just make sure you bring the engine up to temperature before shutting it down and placing the car back into storage. The problem is if you just start the car the oil will not get hot enough to drive off the moisture. Remaining moisture can react with contaminates and form acids. Acids are bad for metals.

Thanks for the feedback! Yeah, mine still shows 60% left...but I want fresh oil in it before storage. Also, good point about letting it come up to temp!

 

[Bricks and Bio]

Hi,

Living in OH means I need to store the NSX for the winter...and who know when the temps will change and the snow will come here!

My quesions are:
1. I know it's best to have a fresh oil change before storing, but how fresh? For example, if I got one now and then stored in November (assume 1K miles/mo.). Will the oil not be fresh enough (I do not track it). Or, should I wait another month or so and then get it done?
2.Similar question...if there are a few nice days mid-winter, can I get the car out, or should I leave it hiberate in the garage with the fresh oil?

Foo on that

I live in Chicago and run my car 12 months a year, plenty of clear days, clear roads in the winter

My car will turn 5 in October

It will be getting it's 2nd oil and filter change and the winter wheels and tires put on in a couple of weeks

 

[cjeezy]

Also, it's been a while since I stored a car. Outside of a battery tender (I have an NSX one) I assume I still use the typical STA-BIL fuel stabalizer?

 

[Dice]

cjeezy, Being in northern Europe (Sweden) where salt is poured on the roads wintertime I always store my sports cars during the winter.

However I only follow the oil change schedule. So no specific oil change for the storage itself.

I don't add any fuel stabilizer, put I always fill up the tank as much as possible.

Then I put on a 12V trickle charger to keep the 12V battery happy.

My big concern is the hybrid battery. The trickle charger does NOT maintain that battery, the only way is to start the engine. The manual says that it should be charged every second month, and I typically have the NSX in storage for 6 months so that would mean two occasions. It's a procedure each time so I prefer to keep it to a minimum, and I've been given the advice that every third month is sufficient (if the charge looks good when I start it up). Thus, in January each year I start her up, roll her out, and switch to Sport+ to keep the engine running. After a few minutes I keep the throttle around 2000 rpm for some time. In total I typically keep the engine running for at least 15 minutes - depending on the outside temperature etc. Then she goes back into the garage.

A nice routine - which also keeps your desire for Spring to arrive alive!

 

[docjohn]

I think you are overthinking the whole storage thing as the preceding folks have mentioned. As a reference my 96 has lived 25 years in NE Pa and there is no specific oil changes I'm compelled to dn the fuel stabilizer. I don't use it. I will run the car in winter on dry roads. I have it on a tender...I know I know old vs new but the same rules apply.I wont treat the S any different.

 

[drmanny3]

Foo on that

I live in Chicago and run my car 12 months a year, plenty of clear days, clear roads in the winter

My car will turn 5 in October

It will be getting it's 2nd oil and filter change and the winter wheels and tires put on in a couple of weeks

I am kind of surprised that you have had the car for 5 years but only changed the oil twice? What happened to Xx miles or 12 months which ever occurs first. I thought of you taking facetious care of your cars, what gives?

 

[cjeezy]

cjeezy, Being in northern Europe (Sweden) where salt is poured on the roads wintertime I always store my sports cars during the winter.

However I only follow the oil change schedule. So no specific oil change for the storage itself.

I don't add any fuel stabilizer, put I always fill up the tank as much as possible.

Then I put on a 12V trickle charger to keep the 12V battery happy.

My big concern is the hybrid battery. The trickle charger does NOT maintain that battery, the only way is to start the engine. The manual says that it should be charged every second month, and I typically have the NSX in storage for 6 months so that would mean two occasions. It's a procedure each time so I prefer to keep it to a minimum, and I've been given the advice that every third month is sufficient (if the charge looks good when I start it up). Thus, in January each year I start her up, roll her out, and switch to Sport+ to keep the engine running. After a few minutes I keep the throttle around 2000 rpm for some time. In total I typically keep the engine running for at least 15 minutes - depending on the outside temperature etc. Then she goes back into the garage.

A nice routine - which also keeps your desire for Spring to arrive alive!

Thanks for the response. Regarding the batteries, I have a battery tender from a previous vehicle, but no idea where to hook ut up to on this thing! That said, my car actually came with an NSX branded charger. Should that be used in the winter as a tender or in the spring after the car has sat and batteries aren't at full charge??? See pics. As you can see, it says "Battery Charger for 12V lead acid batteries."

 

[drmanny3]

You should use the battery tender (NSX) rather than the other one you have. I keep mine plugged in when the car is in the garage for a couple of days. This insures your battery stays in tip top shape. The connection is just under the glove box. My car did not come with the battery tender. I purchased from a person who sold their car and kept the charger. I had to purchase the wire harness and install it. Because it is really tight in my garage, I cannot open the passenger door. I have to crawl over the seat to connect it. I went ahead and purchased an extension from the supplier that connects directly to the battery. I then connected the end to the front bumper opening. So I can connect my charger either at the front of the car or via the glovebox connection. You can buy via Amazon. CTEC makes the charger and brands it for Acura. The unit tells me when the voltage drops sufficiently to necessitate hookup.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J012JH2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[cjeezy]

You should use the battery tender (NSX) rather than the other one you have. I keep mine plugged in when the car is in the garage for a couple of days. This insures your battery stays in tip top shape. The connection is just under the glove box. My car did not come with the battery tender. I purchased from a person who sold their car and kept the charger. I had to purchase the wire harness and install it. Because it is really tight in my garage, I cannot open the passenger door. I have to crawl over the seat to connect it. I went ahead and purchased an extension from the supplier that connects directly to the battery. I then connected the end to the front bumper opening. So I can connect my charger either at the front of the car or via the glovebox connection. You can buy via Amazon. CTEC makes the charger and brands it for Acura. The unit tells me when the voltage drops sufficiently to necessitate hookup.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00J012JH2/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

To clarify, when you say battery tender (NSX), you mean the one in the pics that says "Battery Charger?"

 

[Bricks and Bio]

I am kind of surprised that you have had the car for 5 years but only changed the oil twice? What happened to Xx miles or 12 months which ever occurs first. I thought of you taking facetious care of your cars, what gives?

My servicing dealership takes care of multiple Gen 2 cars

I brought up the oil change frequency with the Service Advisor and spoke with the head tech (NSX Master Level) and they both said just go by the car's computer

I am from the 80s era Hondas, change oil 3-4 times a year but with a big reservoir of Mobil 1 it seems the Gen 2 NSX is fine going longer between changes

For my new Lexus, I brought it in at 1000 miles for the winter to summer wheel/tire change and asked if they would do the oil and filter per the book, and the Service Advisor said wait till the car is a year old

 

[sbkim]

When should I consider using battery tender? I am planning to drive the car at least once a month throughout the winter. Do I still need to use it to maintain 12v battery?

 

[Dice]

cjeezy and sbkim, the battery charger only maintains the 12V battery, not the hybrid battery.

I've got the NSX-branded one, and I'm using it at all times (except when I'm away from home) to keep the 12V battery happy. Without a charged 12V battery you cannot start the car, and you might experience electrical gremlins if the charge is getting low.

As drmanny3 said, the NSX-branded charger is connected under the glove box inside the coupe, and yes the cord gets squeezed when you close the door. It's recommended to have the cord near the front of the door.

Any other 12V charger you'd connect directly to the battery, or through an extension as drmanny3 did.

That said.

It's more important to take care of the hybrid battery. As I wrote, during winter storage I'll fire her up at least once. Make sure the engine is warm and the hybrid battery is fully charged before you are done. Use Sport+ to keep the engine running.

sbkim, If you are driving the car every month, or every second month, you don't need to worry about the hybrid battery.

But I would still use the 12V charger both summer and winter.

 

[drmanny3]

To clarify, when you say battery tender (NSX), you mean the one in the pics that says "Battery Charger?"

no use the one that has the NSX logo. It has a specific charging program for lead acid batteries that are mat based.

 

[drmanny3]

When should I consider using battery tender? I am planning to drive the car at least once a month throughout the winter. Do I still need to use it to maintain 12v battery?

Using the battery tender between drives will not heart the battery, and more likely extend its life. If you have the hookup in the car near the bottom of the glove box it will flash Orange when the voltage drops below a thread hold. So you could wait till then if you want.

 

[sbkim]

cjeezy and sbkim, the battery charger only maintains the 12V battery, not the hybrid battery.

I've got the NSX-branded one, and I'm using it at all times (except when I'm away from home) to keep the 12V battery happy. Without a charged 12V battery you cannot start the car, and you might experience electrical gremlins if the charge is getting low.

As drmanny3 said, the NSX-branded charger is connected under the glove box inside the coupe, and yes the cord gets squeezed when you close the door. It's recommended to have the cord near the front of the door.

Any other 12V charger you'd connect directly to the battery, or through an extension as drmanny3 did.

That said.

It's more important to take care of the hybrid battery. As I wrote, during winter storage I'll fire her up at least once. Make sure the engine is warm and the hybrid battery is fully charged before you are done. Use Sport+ to keep the engine running.

sbkim, If you are driving the car every month, or every second month, you don't need to worry about the hybrid battery.

But I would still use the 12V charger both summer and winter.

Great info. I don't have NSX branded tender but just a universal CTEK which should work as well except I need to install it in the front.

 

[sbkim]

Using the battery tender between drives will not heart the battery, and more likely extend its life. If you have the hookup in the car near the bottom of the glove box it will flash Orange when the voltage drops below a thread hold. So you could wait till then if you want.

Unfortunately I don't have the dealer installed tender. I'll have to make universal CTEK work.

 

[cjeezy]

no use the one that has the NSX logo. It has a specific charging program for lead acid batteries that are mat based.

The NSX logo is the one in the picture. It just says "battery charger" not "battery tender."

 

[drmanny3]

The NSX logo is the one in the picture. It just says "battery charger" not "battery tender."

Same thing

 

[drmanny3]

Unfortunately I don't have the dealer installed tender. I'll have to make universal CTEK work.

So just to repeat CTEK makes the units for Acura. Their accessories will work with either the Acura unit or the CTEK unit. The connections are the same. If you want you can purchase the NSX harness that will attach inside and above the glove box. I did that an would crack my window to accommodate the cable. Got tired of doing that and I added a connector from CTEK directly to the battery and the ran the wire towards the front of the car. I did not have to drill any holes, rather there is a way to access the front of the bumper opening. A simpler way would be to connect to the battery and then pop the hood to hook up. So lots of options.

 

[drmanny3]

My servicing dealership takes care of multiple Gen 2 cars

I brought up the oil change frequency with the Service Advisor and spoke with the head tech (NSX Master Level) and they both said just go by the car's computer

I am from the 80s era Hondas, change oil 3-4 times a year but with a big reservoir of Mobil 1 it seems the Gen 2 NSX is fine going longer between changes

For my new Lexus, I brought it in at 1000 miles for the winter to summer wheel/tire change and asked if they would do the oil and filter per the book, and the Service Advisor said wait till the car is a year old

I hear you with respect to the car’s computer telling you when to change the oil. There is an algorithm that takes various inputs to determine when things should occur. So if you drive your car really hard I suspect that the program will apply some preventative as well as predictive maintenance inputs to arrive at a schedule that could differ from that of time and/or mileage.

Way back Toyota had a 3 litter engine used across the board in a lot of cars. In particular Lexus RX 300. People sometimes did not drive enough to warrant changing the oil. They may have driven a lot of short drives as well. The cumulative impact was a sludge build up that prevented oil from properly lubricating the engine. The result a shit load of bad engines, which Toyota decided to quietly repair for free. They did not want a recall which would have officially designated the engine having a defect in design. They came out with 12 months or mileage to determine when a oil change was required. They also quietly redesigned the engine and oil flow design. since then the automotive industry has adopted this time and mileage change schedule.

Going to direct injection has made this even more important. Oil changes are cheap in relationship to damage or contamination. We are lucky that our engines have two injectors per cylinder. So even though our engine is direct injection we also have a port injector. So oil contamination is less an issue. Personally I want my internal components in the cleanest oil. I frequently changed my oil in my 2001 NSX that had a Comptech supercharger. I could tell that the car reved more freely following an oil change and I was doing that every 3000 miles or less. Our NC1 engine is a race engine that has very close tolerances and deserves the best in my opinion. Having said that each to his own, I am sure your engine will not suffer.

 

[Honcho]

Going to direct injection has made this even more important. Oil changes are cheap in relationship to damage or contamination. We are lucky that our engines have two injectors per cylinder. So even though our engine is direct injection we also have a port injector. So oil contamination is less an issue. Personally I want my internal components in the cleanest oil. I frequently changed my oil in my 2001 NSX that had a Comptech supercharger. I could tell that the car reved more freely following an oil change and I was doing that every 3000 miles or less. Our NC1 engine is a race engine that has very close tolerances and deserves the best in my opinion. Having said that each to his own, I am sure your engine will not suffer.

+1 Smart man. My view is that, as you say, while changing on the computer interval won't hurt anything, you have so much money invested in the car that it makes sense to change more frequently. Another issue with GTDI engines (both of my Fords are the 3.5 Ecoboost twin turbos) is that you get fuel contamination and dilution of the oil. Even though a good full synth will last 7,500 or even 10,000+ miles before it begins to degrade, it will become contaminated by fuel long before that time. The fuel thins down the oil to a 20W or less. On the GT-R, which has a very similar engine to the NC1, I changed every 12 months regardless of mileage for this reason. I think it makes a lot of sense for the NC1 too!

 

[Kim2017NSX]

When I purchased my 2017 NSX late Dec last year it had 9.7K miles on it. The oil change indicator said it had 80 percent life remaining. By June 28 of this year with 15.8K miles on the car the indicator was down to 5 percent and started warning me at 10 or 15 percent oil life left. So I had the oil, filter changed and they gave the car a full inspection. I also had them replace the air and pollen filters at this time at my request. This isn't something they suggested but agreed it would be a good idea to do. When they replaced the rear diffuser under warranty the car had 17K miles on it and I paid for them to replace the dual clutch and transmission fluid and brake fluid. Now the car has 18.8K miles on it and the computer tells me the has 60 percent oil life left. I definitely don't baby my car but I do make sure the maintenance is done. With an engine that would cost about $90K to replace and a transmission and braking system that isn't cheap cutting corners on maintenance isn't smart IMO and will pay dividends down the road.

And the sensors that determine how hard the car is driven definitely seem to work because its only been 3K miles and 3 months since I had the oil changed and I'm being told I've used 40 percent of the oil life.

Also I just had a set of Pirelli P Zero Trofeo R tires installed (same as what the Type S gets). They are even stickier than the Conti Sportcontact 6s I got a few months ago and the ride quality is actually better. I'm running 32 lbs psi cold. From the tread pattern they look like they will be pretty awful in rainy conditions and I doubt they will last much more than 5K miles based on how soft the compound is. So I'll put the Conti's back on when we hit the rainy season in LA.

 

[drmanny3]

+1 Smart man. My view is that, as you say, while changing on the computer interval won't hurt anything, you have so much money invested in the car that it makes sense to change more frequently. Another issue with GTDI engines (both of my Fords are the 3.5 Ecoboost twin turbos) is that you get fuel contamination and dilution of the oil. Even though a good full synth will last 7,500 or even 10,000+ miles before it begins to degrade, it will become contaminated by fuel long before that time. The fuel thins down the oil to a 20W or less. On the GT-R, which has a very similar engine to the NC1, I changed every 12 months regardless of mileage for this reason. I think it makes a lot of sense for the NC1 too!

Contamination is the real issue here. For new cars in general tight tolerances require good maintenance procedures. When I taught the Toyota Production System some years ago we would talk about how general maintenance often does not consider how equipment is being used. Rarely do companies follow the recommendations made by the manufacturer. They typically run the equipment based upon their needs so often equipment is run in extreme conditions. And because there are no immediate problems, people will generally ignore the equipment. If there is no instant result then there is no need to do things differently. Toyota and other companies pursued predictive maintenance by collecting data and doing the analysis to better understand what actually happens. I also taught DOE so that we could better understand the optimal operating parameters. The US has been behind the Japan for sure as well as other progressive European organizations.

So the bottom line is often the manufacturer does not truly understand how their products age and deteriorate. So given this is a new engine for Acura, I prefer to behave in a cautious manner. The downside is loss of use (during service) and excess money spent on labor and materials. The upside is very little wear.

As Honcho stated fuel dilution is a real thing. It happens in some engines more than others. My 2017 Volvo XC90 Plug in puts out 316 hp from a two litter engine. It is both supercharged and turbo charged to cover the entire rpm range. It really screams. The problem is that it is direct injection and easily gets oil contamination on the valves as there is only one injector. BMW engines have this same issue. Heard of cleaning the system with walnut shells? Anyway Volvo says go 10,000 miles between oil changes as a general statement. So while it is only initial impressions a number of failures seem to pop up.

Folks believe that their cars never consume oil between changes. The truth is while the volume might not change the composition often does. Moisture, fuel, and contamination all contribute to what we perceive as the same. So as our Mom would tell us as we went out to play BE CAREFUL!