The snap ring thing - part three

Joined
10 October 2000
Messages
52
Location
Bexley, England
Well, it's official, the snap ring has failed and has damaged fifth gear as its fragments have whizzed through the gearbox. Replacing the gearbox casing, the bits of 5th gear, the clutch - while we're in there - and the various odds and ends will probably top £4,000. Here's the text of a letter I wrote this morning to Honda Customer Relations UK.... I'll let you know how I get on :-)

Dear Sir,





I am writing to you to ask whether you would reimburse, as a gesture of goodwill, the cost of a part required to repair my 1992 Honda NSX.

You may be aware that a manufacturing defect affected a proportion of gearboxes fitted to this model between 1991 and 1992. Transmissions bearing serial numbers between J4A4-1003542 and J4A4-1005978 were manufactured using a three piece bit to cut the groove in which the countershaft bearing snap-ring is sited. As the three piece bit aged some of the grooves were machined outside ( above ) their normal tolerances and the snap-ring was thus free to flex within the groove.

This results in an inevitable failure and the enclosed technical service bulletin 93-010, issued by Acura, who market the car in the United States, give details of the remedial work required as a result.

The gearbox on my NSX ( # J4A4-1003815 ) falls within the reference range. The snap ring has failed, and the countershaft transmits impulses up to the gear stick when second gear is selected and the car accelerates and decelerates. The car has been driven very little since the fault manifested itself so the resulting damage to the gears and shafts themselves has been minimised.



In the USA Acura have accepted that this was a design and manufacturing fault and have replaced the faulty part as a goodwill gesture if it has failed in a gearbox from the reference range.

This problem does not only affect NSXs supplied to the US market. My car was UK supplied when new. Other NSX drivers in the Netherlands and Switzerland have reported identical faults with their 1991-2 cars.

Acura USA have replaced entire transmissions as a matter of goodwill when faced with the problem, but I imagine that the cost of such a response on your part would be prohibitive as the gearbox is priced at over £7500 in the UK.

As the car has just covered its 60,000th mile I am taking this opportunity to replace the clutch, a repair that would entail removal of the gearbox in any event, so the labour costs would be roughly equivalent.

However, the only way to ensure that the snap ring does not fail again is to obtain a new gearbox housing in which the snap ring groove has been correctly machined. This part alone costs £900 and it is this part that I am asking you to supply gratis.

I am told by the mechanics at Guy Salmon Honda that the 5th gear and shaft are showing sings of damage disproportionate to the car’s mileage and that this has probably been caused by fragments of the broken snap ring. If you could subsidise the cost of these parts in addition that would be a most generous gesture on your behalf. The total cost of the entire repair, including the replacement clutch and labour costs, will probably exceed £4000. Even if you are generous enough to subsidise the cost of parts it would amount to little over 20% of the total.

I am told that the parts have been ordered and that repairs could take place soon after January 18th, and so I would appreciate a reply before that date.

Yours sincerely,
 
Martyn,
Hello.. Sorry for your difficulty. I dont want to sound like an oppertunist, but I might have an option for you. I have a 1995 vintage J spec 5 speed. It has only 31K miles (or 50K kilometers) Factory, heavy Ring and Pinion, and Japaneese Short gears.
Might be a good alternative for you.
Lemme know if Honda takes care of you. Good luck. Respectfully,
david
 
Hello Martyn,

I cannot pass on this without adding (again) what happened to me with Honda Europe and the "not very"-customer friendly behaviour of Honda in Europe.

In March 2000, before buying the car I asked Honda Switzerland about the problem since my old car (a very good condition '91 unfortunately in the snap ring range) was perfect for me apart for this tranny issue.
They told me that there was no such problem in Switzerland/Europe and it was an Acura related problem. My knowledge at that time was not good enough and I bought the car anyway. In November 2000 ago my tranny failed and with the very kind help of Mark Johnson and Lud that furnished me the TSB I returned to Honda Switzerland showing them the problem I encountered (my garage confirmed them that the problem was actutally that!) but they said that they did not know anything about it and that mine was the first time they heard of.

My garage, that of course also did not know anything about the TSB I showed them, because never informed by Honda, told me that they had a similar case some years ago on another '91 but they thought it was due to misuse and the owner had to pay(!!!) for the entire work.
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I told them that I did not want them to apply a special goodwill but at least to goodwill my case since I was told by them that the problem did not exist and I bought THIS car only because of their false advice.
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I received a "NO" motivated by the fact that my car is 9 years old... and this did not answer to my request... they also told me that they are not allowed by Honda to do any goodwill. Only Acura does that since they have a bigger budget for goodwills due to the higher prestige in comparison to the 'normal' Honda brand. This was told to Honda Switzerland by Honda Europe, located in Belgium.
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I asked them (the Tech.Manager of Honda Switzerland) to have the possibility to speak with the president of the company and they always negated me this possibility by giving me some weird motivation... at the end (one month of trials) I spoke with him and he was very arrogant and dismissed me in two minutes.

I'd like to remember that the president races in the Honda Trophy with his NSX and he knows other mailing list members and cannot disagree on the fact that he was aware of this problem.
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Actually, i think Honda Europe hasn't issued a single TSB for the NSX. Nor do they admit to any TSB's issued in the states.
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Not that it's any help to us euro's, but what happened to that lawsuit against Acura in the states?
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(BTW, Gheba, please say 'hi' to Enzo (the real one) when you see him from the dutch geezer)
 
Sorry to hear, Martyn. I have a '92 NSX in snapring range with 45,000 miles on it. It hasn't failed yet but I have been preparing. The best all-around deal I have found so far seems to be at www.daliracing.com. They sell a close ratio transmission with new case for $2,300 US which includes a $700 core. $3,925 will get you close ratio transmission with a new box plus the streetracer clutch. Hope this will help. Mike
 
Mike,

Unless you're planning to do work on the transmission anyway, you're better off not worrying about it, instead of putting money into it when it may never fail if you don't.

The best advice on what to do with a car in the snap ring range was presented by Mark Basch; click here to read it. The key sentences in that write-up are as follows:

"A snap ring and case costs no more to replace after a failure as it does before unless you drive a long time that way."

"I do not recommend replacing the case before a failure, unless you have the tranny apart anyway i.e. synchro replacement or short gear install. Definitely do it at this time, if you are in range."
 
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