The Last testaments of a great car

[drmanny3]

I am saddened by the demise of the NSX. There will be many who offer their assessment of what went wrong. Certainly on this forum as well as in other media I hear/read about how Honda/Acura screwed things up. I am always amused by all the Monday Quarterbacks who clearly know what Honda/Acura did wrong and what they would have done differently.

First most of those supplying the critiques have never had a high level corporate position nor would they have qualified to manage the introduction of a new car. And there are those who just did not like the car from the beginning as it did not resemble the original NSX enough. In addition, many did not have the money nor capacity to make such a purchase. I guess that is just the social media cesspool we currently live in.

If you bother to read the available literature (2015-2016) from Acura to the Dealerships you will see that they set out to make the NC1 introduction a successful and memorable one. They always valued the customer and knew how important it was to provide a total positive experience. Unfortunately, you have what you have and you do the best you can in putting together a total package: Product, Promotion, Pricing, Distribution, and Manufacturing.

See the following:

2017-Acura-NSX-Consultation-and-Delivery-Guide.pdf (nsxwiki.com)
PowerPoint Presentation (nsxwiki.com) #1
PowerPoint Presentation (nsxwiki.com) #2
Service Update – recommended parts stocking (nsxwiki.com) #3
Service Update – recommended parts stocking (nsxwiki.com) #4
Service Update – recommended parts stocking (nsxwiki.com) #5

I have a 2017 NSX which was optioned with everything including the Novella Blue paint. I find it in every way a compliment to the early cars having owned a 91 NSX and a 2001 NSX-T. It is not only better looking, but also more comfortable, faster, easier to drive, and equally well made. I morn the demise of this car as it signals the beginning of an end to a era.

 

[docjohn]

I think your thread title should be "the dead sea scrolls"....My feeling all along has been that the "corporation" as a whole was conflicted about NC1.This was a US driven product built and designed.I think the lack of support(enthusiasm) from Japan stifled and eventually killed it. The Acura brand is what they really need to figure out. If they had spun out the NC1 and the supercar ethos to a limited but dedicated dealership network maybe they would have gotten better results. As you said it is all water under the bridge to nowhere...I think it performs very well with the Hp it has.

 

[Heavymetals]

The success of a low production sports car vs a "high production" one.

HONDA decided to come out with one model, vs GM which comes out with an introductory model (at almost 1/2 the price, but it is a GM car).

Once GM sets a market it offers different options.

The Z06 will not be the final C8 offering.

 

[Heavymetals]

I think your thread title should be "the dead sea scrolls"....My feeling all along has been that the "corporation" as a whole was conflicted about NC1.This was a US driven product built and designed.I think the lack of support(enthusiasm) from Japan stifled and eventually killed it. The Acura brand is what they really need to figure out. If they had spun out the NC1 and the supercar ethos to a limited but dedicated dealership network maybe they would have gotten better results. As you said it is all water under the bridge to nowhere...I think it performs very well with the Hp it has.

I think HONDA screwed themselves by teasing the car for so many years.

The actual production was a "sh*t or get off the pot".

The reason why I bought one was I decided that if I was gonna get a hybrid, it was going to be a bitchin one and the NSX was the cheapest of the super hybrids, a used PORSCHE 918 (if you could find one) was $1 million.

I know I am in the minority on this, but I still consider the NSX a bargain and it is a freaking HONDA.

I expect a lot of boo hooing when you can't get one.

 

[Honcho]

Like the NA2, this car will become very desirable once out of production.

I think the NC1 is a fantastic car that was let down in the marketing and corporate side (we may still get one).

I'm really happy to see a Type-S re-appear but sad to see the NSX go away again.

I don't think this is the last we've seen of the NSX.

 

[drmanny3]

I meant to add another document but I cannot find it. There was a video training program for the Dealerships that I had the chance to review some time ago. It attempted to identify the buyer of a new NSX as having a yearly income or source of funds in the neighborhood of $400,000. They mentioned this figure in an effort to insure that the Dealerships recognized that the NSX buyer was not the person coming in for a RDX or MDX. As noted above it is very difficult to manage such different customers. Just imagine if a Ferrari Dealership began selling Fiats. There is no rhythm or reason. Chevrolet can sell a Corvette because they have been doing so for over 60 years. While the car was the most expensive of Chevies, it was not out of the ball park. Corvettes are the common man's sports car. Ford has sold the Thunderbird and Mustang for an equal amount of time. The Ford GT was way more expensive and exclusive than a typical Ford product and was not an upsale effort. And of course there is Dodge who sold the Viper.

In the end it was not just one thing that could have made the NSX a more successful car. This market segment is very small in comparison to the bread and butter of the automotive world. I am so grateful that Honda/Acura made the effort. We are all better off having this car whether or not it goes on in the future in another iteration.

 

[docjohn]

great examples of bread and butter manufacturers who are successful in selling upmarket with the same pancake just with more toppings...look at stallantis/FCA...they pump out low priced challengers/durangos all day but plop in a HC engine/adjustable suspension bits/stronger trannie and can charge 3x for the same vehicle...they can't make them fast enough...Today though some of that buying of ICE cars is because guys are panicking abit thinking all E is coming tomorrow...

 

[Honcho]

great examples of bread and butter manufacturers who are successful in selling upmarket with the same pancake just with more toppings...look at stallantis/FCA...they pump out low priced challengers/durangos all day but plop in a HC engine/adjustable suspension bits/stronger trannie and can charge 3x for the same vehicle...they can't make them fast enough...Today though some of that buying of ICE cars is because guys are panicking abit thinking all E is coming tomorrow...

Honda is going all-in on electrification (including fuel cell). They said their withdrawal from F1 is a direct result of this decision, and I imagine the end of the NSX is too. They are done with the ICE and will be devoting 100% of their R&D effort to the new frontier and they are doing it early. I respect that. I also think that means we will see new performance models from Honda in that space. S3000? NSX Gen3?

 

[Hothonda]

Current Car & Driver on the their EV of the year test + 1000 mile real world test:

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a36877370/2021-car-and-driver-ev-of-the-year-contenders/

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a36877585/ev-1000-11-electric-cars-long-distance-race/

The short story in the final quote of the test article ⬇︎

"Our drivers are split when asked whether the EV 1000 was harder or easier than expected, but most say that if they were to do the trip again, they would do one thing differently: drive a gas car. And that includes the Tesla drivers. We'll know that the charging networks and EV technology are fully baked when we're no longer saying that."

 

[ArabianOak]

I meant to add another document but I cannot find it. There was a video training program for the Dealerships that I had the chance to review some time ago. It attempted to identify the buyer of a new NSX as having a yearly income or source of funds in the neighborhood of $400,000. They mentioned this figure in an effort to insure that the Dealerships recognized that the NSX buyer was not the person coming in for a RDX or MDX. As noted above it is very difficult to manage such different customers. Just imagine if a Ferrari Dealership began selling Fiats. There is no rhythm or reason. Chevrolet can sell a Corvette because they have been doing so for over 60 years. While the car was the most expensive of Chevies, it was not out of the ball park. Corvettes are the common man's sports car. Ford has sold the Thunderbird and Mustang for an equal amount of time. The Ford GT was way more expensive and exclusive than a typical Ford product and was not an upsale effort. And of course there is Dodge who sold the Viper.

In the end it was not just one thing that could have made the NSX a more successful car. This market segment is very small in comparison to the bread and butter of the automotive world. I am so grateful that Honda/Acura made the effort. We are all better off having this car whether or not it goes on in the future in another iteration.

Exactly...my treatment when I brought my NSX in last month was below Ford level let alone exotic level. My daily driver is a Tesla and that has by far been the best service I have received. The tesla tech's are very polite, always provide a loaner and text me all day long about the status of my car. Everything is clear.

150k NSX at acura and thrown nothing but shade! Sad.

 

[Hothonda]

⬆︎ At least at w/Porsche, they see their service customers leaving many multiple $100 bills (or equal) on the cashier's counter.

 

[drmanny3]

I have owned more than 80 cars in my lifetime. About a third were new. In most instances it was love the manufacturer but hate the dealership. Only a few measured up. Saturn and Lexus come to mind. In the case of Saturn they got screwed by GM the manufacturer. Lexus has had good and bad days but generally done well in spite of Toyota.

While I disliked Bush and his defense secretary I remember hearing him say you go to war with what you have……

 

[RYU]

Many facts have been documented about the NC1 in this forum. These facts (and opinions) will remain here on nsxprime.com (I hope) when in 10-20 yrs when we wonder... why did this car sell in such low volumes but yet loved by so many, though not all, of its owners. An analysis of these loyal owners will likely point to a specific demographic of which we may never know if they were in fact Acura's targeted demographic to begin with. I suspect the current owner group is only a small subset of the intended demographic if they were even the intended target at all (i.e. the Scion problem). Certainly the current NA1/NA2 majority owner group today is arguably very different than the 1st owners of these cars - yet have the loudest voice on the internet but I digress...

I'd love to still be alive many years from now when some retroactive analysis or business case comes out on the market success/failure of this vehicle. I'm more fascinated with the NC1 as a business case than I am about the car itself.

 

[docjohn]

The answer will be similar to why you only see soursop ice cream in the Caribbean...

 

[docjohn]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/ent...-to-race-after-the-street-car-dies/ar-AAN1B0I

 

[RyanRA]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/ent...-to-race-after-the-street-car-dies/ar-AAN1B0I

Ahh, yes. The NC1 Type R variant has always been available as the GT3.

 

[NbyNW]

I meant to add another document but I cannot find it. There was a video training program for the Dealerships that I had the chance to review some time ago. It attempted to identify the buyer of a new NSX as having a yearly income or source of funds in the neighborhood of $400,000. They mentioned this figure in an effort to insure that the Dealerships recognized that the NSX buyer was not the person coming in for a RDX or MDX. As noted above it is very difficult to manage such different customers. Just imagine if a Ferrari Dealership began selling Fiats. There is no rhythm or reason. Chevrolet can sell a Corvette because they have been doing so for over 60 years. While the car was the most expensive of Chevies, it was not out of the ball park. Corvettes are the common man's sports car. Ford has sold the Thunderbird and Mustang for an equal amount of time. The Ford GT was way more expensive and exclusive than a typical Ford product and was not an upsale effort. And of course there is Dodge who sold the Viper.

In the end it was not just one thing that could have made the NSX a more successful car. This market segment is very small in comparison to the bread and butter of the automotive world. I am so grateful that Honda/Acura made the effort. We are all better off having this car whether or not it goes on in the future in another iteration.

I had to do a follow-up to my oil change a few weeks ago and it was an embarrassing shit-show from the dealer. What a cluster-f***.

I’m confident the mechanical part is sound but the rest was completely unsatisfactory. I left just shaking my head and knowing full well why the NSX didn’t succeed.

 

[Bricks and Bio]

Lots of variability on the dealership end.

Both my selling dealer and servicing dealer have provided superior experiences.

The servicing dealer for both my Acura and Lexus have the same ownership and are super fast at responding to requests, keep me updated, loaner always ready, hand wash for me (at the Lexus store, they usually put the cars through the automated tunnel but they are so into the LC 500 Convertible that they get a tech to hand wash it for me instead).

Oddly I tried purchasing from both and their sales side of the stores are no where near as good to work with.

Back to the topic, I am probably close to the target customer, except older.

The Acura playbooks were fine but Acura didn't police the dealerships behaviors, really allowed the stab and grabbing and after the initial customers got turned off/went elsewhere they were terrible slow to find ways to get the next rounds of potential customers behind the wheel to see how much fun the car is.

I am not sad the program got shut down as I have enjoyed my car.

I am also number by having witnessed the slow seizing up of the situation since around Q2 of 2017.

 

[RYU]

Not sure where to post this but just to confirm what we all already knew but probably didn't want to believe... As posted on a private social media page by a former Honda employee involved with the development of the NC1; As mandated by Honda Sales execs (the bean counters, not the designer and engineers) there was indeed significant value engineering that occured to the interior design of the car to meet a certain price point.

Personally speaking... I wonder how it would have affected sales if they inflated the price $5k or even $10k but delivered the car with anything close to the concept car's interior which was adorned with high quality materials and details (even for just a concept). We can speculate but truthfully we would never know for sure. I feel bad for my engineer/designer friends there. I hear stories all the time that the passion is dead because whatever hard work they put forth is just striken down and/or neutered.

What was presented: https://www.netcarshow.com/acura/2013-nsx_concept/#2

What we got:

 

[docjohn]

I'm wondering if this being the last year will actually turn some shoppers away..

 

[RYU]

I know. I know. I need to shut up. I'm just so disappointed and a little bit hurt. I wanted to buy this car so badly. In 2015 I remember telling my wife and even she got super excited about it. She asked me for up to 2 years following if i'm going to buy the car. I just couldn't do it and may never will. A little bit of me is still willing to try ownership one day but it will be a while. Sitting inside of one.. I just get so disappointed.

 

[DJ Iceman]

A little bit of me is still willing to try ownership one day but it will be a while. Sitting inside of one.. I just get so disappointed.

You can't compare it to "what could have been", you have to enjoy it for what it is.

I'll give you an example: I used to be a Disney Imagineer who worked on theme park projects in Anaheim, Orlando, and Shanghai. Those projects are absolutely AMAZING in the blue sky stage, when cost is no object. But reality has to be applied at some point, and the value engineering begins. Of course some projects come through that process better than others, and it's often disappointing to the Imagineers involved throughout to see what is ultimately delivered compared to our original grand plans. But in general the guests, who just see what is produced, love them! They have no point of comparison.

Yes, I'd have preferred an NSX with a sticker price $15k higher to get an interior like that concept. But the interior we do have is comfortable, classy, and supremely comfortable for street driving, highway cruising, and track thrashing. Don't prevent yourself from owning this amazing machine just because "it could have been better"--it's incredible just the way it is.

 

[RYU]

You can't compare it to "what could have been", you have to enjoy it for what it is.

I'll give you an example: I used to be a Disney Imagineer who worked on theme park projects in Anaheim, Orlando, and Shanghai. Those projects are absolutely AMAZING in the blue sky stage, when cost is no object. But reality has to be applied at some point, and the value engineering begins. Of course some projects come through that process better than others, and it's often disappointing to the Imagineers involved throughout to see what is ultimately delivered compared to our original grand plans. But in general the guests, who just see what is produced, love them! They have no point of comparison.

Yes, I'd have preferred an NSX with a sticker price $15k higher to get an interior like that concept. But the interior we do have is comfortable, classy, and supremely comfortable for street driving, highway cruising, and track thrashing. Don't prevent yourself from owning this amazing machine just because "it could have been better"--it's incredible just the way it is.

I totally get your point. I'll refrain from opening up a can of worms but I wish my disappointment could be contained that easily. Ignorance is bliss and I've driven too many cars in that range I prefer just a little more net net. Personal preference of course but a nice interior would have made me forget about it's other shortcomings (3800lbs) at least in my book. I do love it's reliability, external good looks, and the hybrid cool factor. Let's see what happens with the Type S.

 

[nis350]

I know the salesman who sold one of the last NA2's for $8K below MSRP. Perhaps we'll know in about 20 years if the NC1's will catch on.

Like the NA2, this car will become very desirable once out of production.

 

[jaybird]

The end of the NSX in 2022 is a sad item for me. I just got back from a Cars & Coffee even in Charlotte NC. Was a 5 1/2 hour drive each way from Chesapeake VA --- the car ride was fantastic -- no issues, and actually pretty good gas mileage (mostly on "Sport" on the interstates) and tons of "thumbs up" from other drivers along the way. I parked in a sea of Ferrari's and Lambo's --- I was the ONLY NSX in the entire event (probably 500 to 600 cars there). I was absolutely stunned at the attention the NSX received, especially in the midst of all of the other exotics. I found that there is a LOT of love out there for this car - despite abysmal sales volume.

I gotta say - there is a lot to like about this car. I think Acura / Honda just didn't know how to handle being in the exotic biz. At the event, Aston Martin had a booth handing out free coffee and doughnuts --- Ferrari had a full contingent of employees walking around greeting folks. The Lambo folks brought one of their race cars. But Honda / Acura was nowhere in sight. Porsche does an incredible job for their owners with monthly publications, emails, events, etc. generating a ton of brand loyalty.

I am fortunate in that the local Acura dealership treats me like gold with the NSX -- but I understand that is not routinely the case elsewhere. It's a shame -- the NSX is really a great car. Now, what does the future hold for it and all of us owners? Time will tell. In the meantime, I'll continue to enjoy. Cheers, Jay