Puff of smoke and... a/c not blowing cold.

[XSNSX]

Hey guys,

I'm scared to find out how much this is gonna cost! Got a "puff" of smoke through the air conditioning vents on my '93 NSX w/66,000 miles today. Parked it immediately to go into a meeting. Returned, started the car and the air was not cold.. at first. As I began driving in city traffic, it began to cool down. Parked again for 3 hours. Started my 22 mile drive home and had absolutely NO cold air. Was wondering if anybody else has experienced this scenario/problem. Hoping to be more educated about this before a mechanic takes advantage of me. I'd appreciate ANY responses ASAP. Heading to the dealer or a mechanic in the morning. Thanks!!

 

[XSNSX]

Anybody else experience this problem? Please reply.

Carl

 

[MiamieNeSeX]

Hey carl, if the cooling diminished gradually sounds like a freon leak in the evaporator.

 

[matteni]

What did the "puff" smell like? Burning? Or did it not have a smell (like dry ice)?

Does the fan work?

Have you checked all the fuses?

Burning - could be seized compressor or fan motor / something of that nature ~ $800 - $1100

No smell - could be leak in evaporator. Replacement up to $2000 - $2800.

 

[matteni]

Also - your local car parts store should have a pressure meter with a coupling to connect to the low (cold side) so you can see the pressure in the system. They usually have marks on the gauge as well.

The one you want to hook up to is near the top of the firewall under the hood. It is the fat black pipe coming out of the evaporator with the blue cap. remove the cap and hook up the quick connect. The meter only costs a dollar or two.

If it is leaking slowly you can convert your system over to R232 (DIY or Acura for about $250). Then you can recharge the system inexpensively and see how long it holds. R232 cans are very inexpensive and much better on the environment as well. If it is a very slow leek you are much better measuring and filling 2x per year then replacing. Also - some of the cans have oil in them (very good) and some have some stop leak (might or might not help - it did for my small leak).

Good luck...

[This message has been edited by matteni (edited 25 October 2002).]

 

[XSNSX]

Hey guys!

Thank you for the quick response. I stopped by Acura of Pompano this morning and the service manager, Louie, believed the problem might be the evaporater, which means the dash has to come out! :-( The leak appeared to very fast, as the air was about 50% warmer than normal, immediately afterwards. I parked for 3-4 hours and when I returned and started the car, there was ABSOLUTELY no cold air. It doesn't sound like this is a slow leak, but I'm wondering if there is a sealant that can be injected into the system to try to "patch" the problem, or... if I could take the evaporater to a precision welder for repair. Either way, the labor for this is going to be costly. Makes me wonder... why does an evaporater fail to begin with?

As I write this, I just recieved a call from a friend at a Honda dealer who was calling around to find someone to do this for a reasonable labor fee. NOBODY wants to touch it!

A little bummed right now. Was hoping to spend this kind of money on new rims!

Carl

 

[matteni]

This is a HUGE job and no one want to do it because it is such a pain. You will want someone experianced.

Unfortunately you can see a good percentage of the evaporator from the front - you just can't get it out in that direction.

An alternative is to get the car up to TN and see the Barn Man. He is a very experianced Acura tech and does excellent side work. He can be reached at [email protected] and will do a hell of a job and save you enough to still get those wheels!

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by matteni:
If it is leaking slowly you can convert your system over to R232 (DIY or Acura for about $250). Then you can recharge the system inexpensively and see how long it holds. R232 cans are very inexpensive and much better on the environment as well.

Nick,

I thought the conversion is to R-134a. Is R232 something different?

I agree that it would be a good idea to convert your car, rather than pay the sky-high prices to refill with freon (R-12). The conversion kit costs around $60 and takes about an hour of dealer labor to install. That shouldn't come to $250.

There are several qualified dealers for NSX service in Florida, and you shouldn't need to drive 1000 miles to Nashville for service. Nothing against BarnMan - he's a great mechanic - but as long as you've got places closer, that's pretty far out of the way. Check around for prices, but on A/C repairs, the estimate may be high simply because the repairs require expensive parts and/or extensive labor.

Also, this may be a good time to join the NSX Club of America, since there are 6-8 dealers in Florida who offer discounts on service and parts to club members. The discount on a single expensive repair can more than pay for the membership dues. Check the website of the Florida Chapter for a listing. If you need to get signed up quickly, send me an e-mail and I can get you signed up within a day.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 25 October 2002).]

 

[matteni]

Ken is right! R-134a not R232 - up too early! R232 is a IT term...

Anyway - Ken is right about checking prices on the conversion. We have 2 dealers in the St. Louis area and our labor rates are higher then most of the country ($95-98/hour).

My charges after tax were $240. You may get a better deal down there as Florida is a "right to work" state.

Also - as for the evaporator charges - I would be surprised if Barn Man couldn't save you $1000 off your best Acura quote. May be worth flying him down and still coming out $750 or more ahead.

As for trying to fix it yourself - you can charge the system with R134a or R12 with dye. Most dealers by law wont charge a system with R12 they know is leaking so you may be stuck doing the conversion either way. When you see how much R12 is per pound you will realize why the dealers keep it behind a lock as big as the one that guards the safe! With the shop manual and a little wrenching you can view the evaporator from the front of the car and see if/where the dye is leaking out. From talking to Acura techs 90% of evap. leaks can be seen before removing the dash. It will also show if it is coming out of some other place / line.

Also - if there is a very small leak and you have done the conversion - there is no real harm in charging with a stop leak to see if it stops a pinhole leak. It probably wont work but I haven't heard of it hurting anything either - but others may have a different opinion on that.

Good luck again / stay cool! BTW - with the windows open at 160MPH the win chill goes down dramatically.

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by matteni:
Anyway - Ken is right about checking prices on the conversion. We have 2 dealers in the St. Louis area and our labor rates are higher then most of the country ($95-98/hour).

My charges after tax were $240. You may get a better deal down there as Florida is a "right to work" state.

I was right about checking prices, wrong about the price. Upon further investigation, it turns out that it usually takes two hours of labor, not one, and you'll also need to pay around $40 for the R-134a refrigerant. So the price Nick paid is pretty typical after all.

 

[4AU4LIFE]

Originally posted by XSNSX:
Hey guys,

I'm scared to find out how much this is gonna cost! Got a "puff" of smoke through the air conditioning vents on my '93 NSX w/66,000 miles today. Parked it immediately to go into a meeting. Returned, started the car and the air was not cold.. at first. As I began driving in city traffic, it began to cool down. Parked again for 3 hours. Started my 22 mile drive home and had absolutely NO cold air. Was wondering if anybody else has experienced this scenario/problem. Hoping to be more educated about this before a mechanic takes advantage of me. I'd appreciate ANY responses ASAP. Heading to the dealer or a mechanic in the morning. Thanks!!

Does the air blow cool at all? Was the 'smoke' blowing out have a smell or anything or did it just evaporate?

I had a very similar problem recently except mine blew warm on one side of center vent and cool on the other but did have same smoke you describe. Luckily for me my father is a certified a/c dude and looked it over for me and determined it was low on freon. Couldn't find a leak ANYWHERE and he looked very well with some high tech sniffing devices and special liquid and glasses.
Anyway, may want to just try a quick freon charge to see if that fixes problem. At worst case it will postpone having to do the evap case job.
Good Luck.

------------------
ALL NSX
92 RED/BLACK 5-SPEED

 

[ANYTIME]

Maybe you can try this

[This message has been edited by ANYTIME (edited 25 October 2002).]

 

[Forums Nazi]

[This message has been edited by Forums Nazi (edited 25 October 2002).]