Porsche TT big reds

len3.8 · 10 January 2003

I have searched the facts and in 2001 there was a short discussion about these calipers on an NSX. I have a wanting for larger brakes. I also have a set of these on a car that is being disassembled. (worth more in parts) Has anyone succesfully installed these on their car and used them over a period of time at track events? I know about the brakes the stopping power, needing bigger wheels. I have that all covered. I am looking to see if I can find a source for a quality bracket. Would I need to use a proportioning valve if I left the rear brakes factory? What rotors are you using with these calipers? What are you using in the rear for calipers, rotors? Would the larger rotors with a special bracket that Ben and I think Andrie(sp?) have/had/ using?
Any input would be appreciated? I am dismantling a good friend and it has decided to be an organ donor for these brakes if they will work.
Thanks
Len
n9s5x-t

ak · 11 January 2003

http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/006985.html

Andrie Hartanto · 11 January 2003

Hi Len,

I have them in my car, mated with the ScienceofSpeed rear brake kit.

You will not want to leave the rear brakes factory, not even with brake bias valve. I tried that, and it didn't work so well. It has such a big braking power, you will able to lock it up, even with ABS!

The biggest gripe I have with this brake is the fact that it is huge. The biggest caliper compare to Comptech, brembo, AP. This makes it almost impossible to find a wheel that will fit perfectly. HRE makes some wheel that will fit over it fine, but I believe the offset still won't allow it to have an agressive front tire size.

It is not cheap. The parts itself is cheaper than any other brake kit out there. I believe it cost me around $1200 in parts at wholesale price. Not including time and labor spent for the brakcets and machining of the caliper. It requires quite extensive work. If I have to sell them new, I would price them at least $2000 just to break even in retail cost.

If I have to do it over again, I'll get the other brake kit that readily available for the car. Either it is AP, brembo, or Comptech pro brakes (my favourite), or tarox. Driven so many different setup, except tarox. I must comment the necessity of upgrading the rear brakes as well. Of course if you only drive the car on the street, it is a moot point.

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len3.8 · 11 January 2003

Originally posted by ak:
http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/006985.html

Thanks Ak, Much appreciated.

len3.8 · 11 January 2003

It is not cheap. The parts itself is cheaper than any other brake kit out there. I believe it cost me around $1200 in parts at wholesale price. Not including time and labor spent for the brakcets and machining of the caliper. It requires quite extensive work. If I have to sell them new, I would price them at least $2000 just to break even in retail cost.

Thanks Andrie that's the input I was looking for. Specifics on the probs you had to get them adapted to your car. I think you are correct, that the fact that someone else has done the fitment work on the other kits. The cnc work for the brackets would be costly.
I'm thinking about the AP kit, I cant see paying for any of the brembo kits when I know what the big reds cost.
I drive the car on the track, at least 7 times per year. Some of the high speed tracks
are the only ones that I experience the fade.
Thanks soo much for your time guys.
Len
n9s5x-t
Brakes in the works.

[/B][/QUOTE]

[This message has been edited by len3.8 (edited 10 January 2003).]

Andrie Hartanto · 11 January 2003

Hi Len,

For $2400/axle, brembo grand turismo is a good streetable kit. I believe it has dust seal, while the others don't have. This makes them more durable for street use, and oyu don't need to rebuild them as often. The other good thing, the caliper will clear most wheels.
Downside, it is pricey for complete front/rear kit, plus add the parking brake option!

The AP brakes are awesome. For the price is the cheapest front/rear kit. It will require a bit more clearance than the brembo brakes, but you don't need extra parking brake kit.

The Tarox probably the best deal real kit front and rear. And it clears even stock wheel. However, I have no first hand experiece with them.

The Comptech big bucks brakes. I must say I am thoroughly impressed with this kit. Outperform any other brake kits I tried. Simply worth the money. I drove one without the rear bias kit, and had no problem whatsoever. I believe DOug Hayashi also don't have bias kit and have no problem.

One important thing I like to emphasize is the importance of brake balance (front/rear). There is a reason the front and rear rotors are the same size on 91-96 NSX. There is a reason the 97 and up NSX has bigger rear diameter on the disc. There is a reason the New NSX-R uses 91-96 front disc brake size and 97-up rear brake size. The NSX need to have sufficient rear brake power to have a good brake balance.

Chuck Mirenda · 11 January 2003

I purchased my Big Reds in Dec 98. The only disadvantage to this brake package is wheel fitment. You are very limited although you can use stock 16" front wheels with a proper spacer. No one will question the stopping potential for these brakes as Porsche criteria for design is 25 consecutive stops from 80% of top speed...without fading. What makes this brake package so attractive to me is replacement cost. I do a minimum of 10 track events per year and after 4 years, I've just purchased my FIRST set of replacement rotors. I'll usually go through 2-3 sets of pads per year. Now consider the list price for Porsche rotors is $216 each and pads are $92 per set. Check that against the competition. On my 95 I used an over-sized RM rear rotor (with RM bracket and stock caliper). On my Zanardi, I have the stock rear brakes. I used to go through 2 sets of stock/aftermarket rotors per year and countless set of pads. I wouldn't consider this or any other big brake setup unless you plan to run R compound tires. This last season I bought a set of 17/18" Forgelines from Realtime Racing and with some mounting mods so the wheels would clear the calipers, was able to run 235/40 17 in front. Add SRF brake fluid to the package, and you can forget about your brakes and worry about how to go faster.

len3.8 · 11 January 2003

Originally posted by Chuck Mirenda:
I purchased my Big Reds in Dec 98. The only disadvantage to this brake package is wheel fitment. You are very limited although you can use stock 16" front wheels with a proper spacer. No one will question the stopping potential for these brakes as Porsche criteria for design is 25 consecutive stops from 80% of top speed...without fading. What makes this brake package so attractive to me is replacement cost. I do a minimum of 10 track events per year and after 4 years, I've just purchased my FIRST set of replacement rotors. I'll usually go through 2-3 sets of pads per year. Now consider the list price for Porsche rotors is $216 each and pads are $92 per set. Check that against the competition. On my 95 I used an over-sized RM rear rotor (with RM bracket and stock caliper). On my Zanardi, I have the stock rear brakes. I used to go through 2 sets of stock/aftermarket rotors per year and countless set of pads. I wouldn't consider this or any other big brake setup unless you plan to run R compound tires. This last season I bought a set of 17/18" Forgelines from Realtime Racing and with some mounting mods so the wheels would clear the calipers, was able to run 235/40 17 in front. Add SRF brake fluid to the package, and you can forget about your brakes and worry about how to go faster.

Chuck, thanks for the response. Longevity was another reason I was considering the Porsche kit, I have it on a car that has been through 10 or so events as well and the rotors are still good. The concern was getting the brackets for them to fit on the car. (Andrie addressed) If could find someone that wasn't throwing the liability issue out at me, that would sell them to me I would do it in a minute. Then I would get the bigger rotor kit for the rear. Wheel fitment and hardware are not an issue for me, the brackets and machining would be.
Thanks
Len

Ponyboy · 12 January 2003

Isn't the Mov'it kit the Porsche Big Reds?

They may be able to help.

len3.8 · 12 January 2003

Originally posted by Ponyboy:
Isn't the Mov'it kit the Porsche Big Reds?

They may be able to help.

I know it looks like it. I noticed that earlier today.
I plan to call them Monday and find out.
Thanks
Len

[This message has been edited by len3.8 (edited 11 January 2003).]

Chuck Mirenda · 12 January 2003

Originally posted by Ponyboy:
Isn't the Mov'it kit the Porsche Big Reds?

They may be able to help.

I bought my Big Reds through Movit's US distributer and at the time that was the only caliper they used. I see that they've added other calipers to their line.

ScienceofSpeed · 12 January 2003

Andrie --

Just an FYI -- Our AP Racing kit has BETTER wheel clearance than the Brembo Gran Turismo kit that you refer to. The Brembo Lotus caliper that is used in the Brembo Gran Turismo is 141mm in width. It requires 40mm of clearance from the hat mounting surface to the face of the caliper. In comparison, the ScienceofSpeed AP Racing kit is uses the 5200 series AP Racing caliper that is 140mm in width with 39mm from the face of the hat to the edge of the caliper.

The 5200 caliper is also much lighter than the Brembo caliper.

Cheers,
-- Chris

EDIT: replaced "disc" with "hat" in AP Racing measurement.

Originally posted by Andrie Hartanto:
The AP brakes are awesome. For the price is the cheapest front/rear kit. It will require a bit more clearance than the brembo brakes, but you don't need extra parking brake kit.

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[This message has been edited by ScienceofSpeed (edited 13 January 2003).]

Andrie Hartanto · 13 January 2003

Chris,

I don't care much about the thickness of the caliper. I actually test fitted a wheel on George's car with the AP. The BBS LM wheels didn't clear. While the BBS LM clears Dave Brown's car with brembo.

The same also applies to Forgeline wheels, which clear brembo without any spacers, but require 3mm spacers to clear the AP.

Measuring from the face of the disc really tell very little input, as both disc are different offset!!

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ScienceofSpeed · 13 January 2003

Measurements were taken off two NSXes with the two different kits side by side. Both cars had the LATEST kits offered by the two manufactures.

The distance from the face of the *hat* to the face of the caliper is important. Think when you add a spacer. Distance from the hat surface to the caliper face will decrease which decreases the wheel clearance requirements.

Regards,
-- Chris

Originally posted by Andrie Hartanto:
Chris,

I don't care much about the thickness of the caliper. I actually test fitted a wheel on George's car with the AP. The BBS LM wheels didn't clear. While the BBS LM clears Dave Brown's car with brembo.

The same also applies to Forgeline wheels, which clear brembo without any spacers, but require 3mm spacers to clear the AP.

Measuring from the face of the disc really tell very little input, as both disc are different offset!!

Andrie Hartanto · 14 January 2003

I guess, I must take your words for it. Your measurements were done more recently, while my wheel fitment test was done about 2 years ago.

They might have made some changes to the design since then. As I heard Brembo took over designing their own kit, when they changed the name to grand turismo.

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Porsche TT big reds

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