One year of ownership - Tire wear question.

[Ruined 2]

In a few days I will have had my 2000 NSX-T for 1 year. It's been a dream come true, but I'm not sure I can afford to keep putting tires on the s.o.b.:biggrin:

When I bought it, it had just under 36K on it and brand new tires (Yokohama OEM sizes and the car's bone stock) all the way around with a fresh alignment (supposedly). By 38K, the fronts were completely gone 2 to 3 inches in from the inside, outside edges cupped but ok. I had another alignment done and two new fronts put on at the local Acura dealer where I have a few family connections. Now at just over 42K, the fronts are almost as bad as they were before the alignment, just not as much wear or as far in on the tire, but still almost toast. The rears are damn near slicks, but wore very evenly. I do drive fairly aggressively around where I live, but most of the miles I've put on this car have been on highways, 2 or 4 lane, getting to and from meets.

I know you veterans of NSX ownership are rolling your eyes in anticipation of my next question, so take a few deep breaths now to prepare for it, and take it easy on us newlyweds...




Is this normal?

 

[nsxtasy]

Some of it is normal, and some of it isn't.

It's normal for the front tires to wear more towards the inside edge of the tread than the outside. This is more likely to occur when the car is NOT driven aggressively. It's not normal for the fronts to only last 2-4K miles, though; 10-15K is a normal lifespan for front tires, even with the uneven wear pattern.

Rear tires lasting 6K miles is also common. Some people get less, some get more.

There are several things you can do. One is the alignment. You can reduce the amount of toe in the rear to make your rears last longer, but at the expense of a slight degradation in handling crispness. You can reduce the amount of toe and negative camber in the front tires to make them last longer, but again, at the expense of handling.

Another thing you can do is to get longer-lasting tires; for example, the Goodyear F1 GS-D3 is an excellent performing tire and should last longer than the OEM tires, and is available in 205/45-16 and 245/40-17 sizes for your stock 16"/17" wheels (not the 215/45-16 stock front size though).

 

[Ruined 2]

So Acura spec on the alignment is more conducive to front tire wear? Or did the dealer just not get it quite right?

I kinda figured the rear wear was close to normal. I got less miles out of the rears on my S2000, so I suppose this is the trade-off.

I planned on switching tires, but I've never had any kind of luck with Goodyear. And I don't know how far off of the OEM sizes I want to go.

Thank you for your info, nsxtasy

The cheapy OEM size Dunlops on Tire Rack, would that just be a complete waste of time?

 

[dnicho05]

If you are actually getting "cupping" and not "feathering" of the tires its not usually an alignment problem. Cupping is almost always caused by a suspenstion issue, not necessarily an alignment issue. The suspension problem can cause alignment issues, but if you are truly getting "cupping" you need to look at other tire and suspension areas.

Typical causes of cupping are:
- loose wheel bearings
- mismounted tire/ wheel assembly
- out of balance wheel assembly or bent rim
- tread design/ tire design - cross this off the list since you are using OEM tires
- worn bearings, shocks, springs or other suspension compnents

With yours being a 2000 model I would be amazed if the front shocks are weak or gone, but you never know. Being that you picked the car up used, you don't know if the previous owner ran over something big or hit a huge pothole at high speed and damaged some of the suspension parts.

You really need to find an NSX expert mechanic (which are not necessarily found at an acura dealership), and have them look things over.

 

[Ruined 2]

Maybe I'm using the wrong term then. It's only a slight edge difference between the tread blocks. Feathering is probably more correct.

The tech that's been working on my car is their "NSX specialist" and has been there longer than everyone but the owner I think, so I trust him as much as I can trust anybody. From what I can see and from what he's told me, there aren't any wheel or suspension problems. That doesn't mean there can't be a problem, just that I feel pretty confident that there isn't.:smile:

I doubt there's an expert NSX mechanic anywhere near me. I see NSX's in my area about as often as Haley's comet, since before buying mine and after. Any ideas how I can track an expert mechanic down?

Thanks to you as well, dnicho05

 

[nsxtasy]

So Acura spec on the alignment is more conducive to front tire wear? Or did the dealer just not get it quite right?

Either (or both) is possible.

I planned on switching tires, but I've never had any kind of luck with Goodyear.

Goodyear didn't used to make the best performance street tires around. Now, with the F1 GS-D3, they're in the market. The F1 GS-D3 is an excellent tire, and many NSX owners have had outstanding results with them. They're unusual in that they offer a combination of outstanding dry performance, outstanding wet performance, and pretty good treadlife, too. Have you seen the recent comparison test in Car and Driver?

I don't know how far off of the OEM sizes I want to go.

You won't have any problems using the sizes I mentioned above. They will be fine.

The cheapy OEM size Dunlops on Tire Rack, would that just be a complete waste of time?

It depends on how much you care about performance and handling. The Dunlop Direzza DZ101 is not a bad tire for the money, but its performance isn't nearly as good as the F1 GS-D3 or the OEM tires. It's designed for people who are more interested in value than performance. It's a very good choice for a family car or sport compact (as long as it isn't going to be used in winter conditions). Most people who get the NSX are more interested in performance and aren't willing to degrade that performance to save a few bucks on tires. Your choice, though.

 

[nsxtasy]

Maybe I'm using the wrong term then. It's only a slight edge difference between the tread blocks. Feathering is probably more correct.

That's what I assumed you were talking about.

Cupping is a condition in which sections of the tread are actually concave, such as in the photos on this website (which was written about trucks, but applies equally to cars).

I doubt there's an expert NSX mechanic anywhere near me. I see NSX's in my area about as often as Haley's comet, since before buying mine and after. Any ideas how I can track an expert mechanic down?

Ask in your regional forum (Northeast region) for recommendations. However, I don't recall ever hearing about mechanics (dealer or independents) with a lot of NSX experience in the Pittsburgh area. The closest ones that do a lot of NSX service work include Davis Acura in the suburbs northeast of Philly, Larry Bastanza (NSXprime username Larry Bastanza) in New York State just north of the NJ border, and I think maybe the two dealers in Columbus.

 

[Ruined 2]

Well, I do care about the performance and handling, obviously, or I'd be driving something else :smile: . But if 4 for the price of 2 would work satisfactorily, I'd give it a shot. I'm sure there's a noticeable difference though. I'm not quite that naive :biggrin: .

I'll check out that comparison. I may try the Goodyear's. Can't be any worse than the Yok's . And I'll probably get it back up to Acura before the snow starts flying to have them eyeball it one more time.

Thanks again nsxtasy, for your knowledge and your patience. :smile:

 

[nsx1]

My 1st NSX was a stock 2000 and its front tires (Yokos) wore out in about 5k miles. I solved the problem by having the alignment set to factory specs except toe - which I had set to zero(0). I never tracked the car, so I would say that I never really drove the car too aggressively. I did not notice any difference in handling with the occasional-not-overly-aggressive street driving. That's not to say you won't notice it. I have a 2002 now, and as soon as I got it, I did the same thing to the alignment. After 8k miles, the fronts (again Yokos) still had tons of tread left, but the rears were gone. (Maybe I drive more aggressive in a straight line. :biggrin

 

[akira3d]

Wow...I just got off the phone with America's Tire and it sounds like the stock Yoko's are currently hard to find. Since I need new shoes soon (track day coming up in November), I'm considering alternatives to the OEM Bridgestones and Yokos for the first time since I've owned my NSX. I'm not quite ready to shop for new wheels, so I'm looking for something that fits the stock (16/17) configuration...too bad the Goodyear doesn't come in 215/45 R16.

Any other tips for someone who wants a good street tire, but ocassionally likes to have some high performance fun? Any experience with Michelin Pilot Sport?

 

[nsxtasy]

Wow...I just got off the phone with America's Tire and it sounds like the stock Yoko's are currently hard to find.

Hi Eric,

Right now, the Tire Rack has all four OEM Bridgestone RE010 in 16"/17" sizes. The OEM Yokohamas are back ordered for front left tires, but they have the other three corners, so if you just need rears, you can get the Yokos too.

Since I need new shoes soon (track day coming up in November), I'm considering alternatives to the OEM Bridgestones and Yokos for the first time since I've owned my NSX. I'm not quite ready to shop for new wheels, so I'm looking for something that fits the stock (16/17) configuration...too bad the Goodyear doesn't come in 215/45 R16.

The Goodyear works perfectly fine in 205/45-16 front, with the stock 245/40-17 rear. Really, it does. You don't have to feel wedded to the stock sizes; it's only 10 mm narrower and you'll never notice the size difference.

Any other tips for someone who wants a good street tire, but ocassionally likes to have some high performance fun?

The Falken Azenis RT-615 is another option. It offers supersticky performance on dry pavement. It's not all that great in the rain, and its treadlife isn't all that great, but it's awesome if you're looking for high performance fun. It comes in the 215/45-16 front size, and you can combine that with 255/40-17 in the rear (it doesn't come in 245/40-17); those sizes will work fine. As a bonus, it's reasonably priced ($95F/$127F at Vulcan).

Incidentally, the Falken Azenis RT-615 is also available in the stock '91-93 sizes for those with 15"/16" wheels, in the stock '02-05 sizes for those with 17"/17" wheels, and in 215/40-17 and 265/35-18 for those with aftermarket 17"/18" wheels.

I still like the F1 GS-D3 if wet weather and/or longevity is a big consideration, but if you're pretty much only concerned about dry performance, I think you'll be very happy with the Falken.

Any experience with Michelin Pilot Sport?

The Goodyear F1 GS-D3 is as good or better in every way, and less expensive, too.

 

[akira3d]

Shortly after I posted, I checked tirerack for the Bridgestones and placed an order. Thanks for the heads up anyway. I decided to stick with OEM simply because that's all I've had up until now and didn't want to add another variable during my second track experience in the car...especially considering that I haven't even had access to my NSX for the past two-and-a-half months (while my garage was being remodeled).

Yeah, I needed all four this time around. This is only the third time I've had to order all at once...and the first time I'm going back to the original Bridgestones since my first all-four-at-once replacement (which is when I first switched to the Yokos).