More Misfortune

[BladesNSX]

okay,

Having shared all my misfortunes with you guys earlier I recieved oustanding support. But apparently someone up there still hates me. On my way home from work on an extremely rainy Miami night I was stuck behind one of those obsurdly slow vehicles with their hazard lights on. True the water was blanketing the road but 20mph was just too slow. Other vehicles were zipping buy me on the left and right of me since I was in the middle lane. I finally spotted an opening on my right. I changed lanes and looked ahead to see someone exiting out of a parking lot into my lane. If I braked I would have rear ended him and thus be found at fault for the accident. I chose instead to go back into the center lane in front of the slow car. Of course the slow car sped up and in the attempt to get in front of him and avoid hitting the vehicle in front of me I drove over a blanket of water and began hydroplaning. The entire car was sent into a spin. I managed to get the car out of the spin but I was still sliding to the left. My right rear HRE rim struck the curb. The Rim is likely damaged beyond repiar. The problem is: HRE no longer makes that rim design. Considering this, what are my options? Assuming the insurance company pays only for the damaged rim and I put up the money for another set of rims, what rims do I get now? Personally I want another set of HRE. I dislike those chrome or wire rims. My car is currently in the best hands with "Uncle Vinnie" but I am still confused about the rims. I can use some advice here.

Take care

Kevin

 

[David]

I am really sorry to hear about this.

Have you talked to HRE about replacing the rim? Even if the wheel is no longer being produced, as a 'custom' shop, they may be able to make you a new one with the equipment they have.

 

[PUREVIL]

What model number are your HRE's?

 

[ilya]

That's terrible. I'm at least glad to hear that your car is ok and just the rim was damaged. Oooh... those HREs are nice.
It's hard to do better than a set of those. If I were you, I would do everything I could to see if you can get another one or get it repaired somehow. It's hard to step down to a different wheel from something like HREs.

 

[Electro]

Where are some pix of those HRE's?

 

[BladesNSX]

Actually I dont know if the car isnt damaged. There is the question of the suspension, axle, etc. I like the idea of asking HRE to "custom" make the rim again. I wonder how hard that would be for them. Great idea David. However I am not certain what model no. rim I have. I think it is the 580.

 

[PUREVIL]

How bad is the rim??? Will it hold air? Is the damage just limited to the edge of the rim? I know when my friend curbed one of his MOMO's he sent it to a company that repaired his wheel for 100 or so. When he got it back it looked like it never got damaged. You may want to consider looking into a wheel repair shop.

 

[ScienceofSpeed]

1. Have a wheel repair shop look at it for you.

2. The HRE you have are likely multi-piece, so the wheels could be broken down, and reassembled with a new rim half, which is likely the same one they use now.

-- Chris

 

[queenlives]

blades,

i can't offer any suggestions on the technical issues you raised, but... and nothing untoward you meant by this, but fwiw... i feel almost compelled to ask you to consider this may be "someone's" (i.e. nature's) way of telling you this may not be the car/environment for you. call it my "old guy" mentality (48 next month) but if it was me going through all of this, i have to confess that i'd consider these to be caution flags.

i began seriously factoring these kinds of events in my high risk activities after my first parachute jump and the parachute on the guy just before me <i was #2> didn't open; i reviewed local white shark population stats against my diving practices when a close friend was severely mauled by a white some years ago... and modified my diving appropriately.

be well and best of luck in bringing your car back to mint+ condition.

hal

 

[nsx4jlp]

Hey Blades I have emailed you a few times because I might know a shop here in Miami that might have them. It is called AutoClass on Bird and 59th. They usually have seeral HRE's in stock. Email me anyways.

Jorge

 

[Nsxotic]

Hey Electro, there are pics of Kevin's car and wheels on my site in the 'friends' toys' section... I'll be in touch Kev.

------------------
Todd Arnold

http://www.geocities.com/nsxcessive/index.html

 

[BladesNSX]

Originally posted by queenlives:
blades,

i can't offer any suggestions on the technical issues you raised, but... and nothing untoward you meant by this, but fwiw... i feel almost compelled to ask you to consider this may be "someone's" (i.e. nature's) way of telling you this may not be the car/environment for you. call it my "old guy" mentality (48 next month) but if it was me going through all of this, i have to confess that i'd consider these to be caution flags.

i began seriously factoring these kinds of events in my high risk activities after my first parachute jump and the parachute on the guy just before me <i was #2> didn't open; i reviewed local white shark population stats against my diving practices when a close friend was severely mauled by a white some years ago... and modified my diving appropriately.

be well and best of luck in bringing your car back to mint+ condition.

hal

Hal,

I appreciate your advice. However, IMO there is a difference between entering a situation of potential negatives, and, a situation where unforseen or unlikely events occur. Nsxotic says I have the worst luck. My luck has been bad throughout my life as I have experienced many hardships and great despair. Does that mean that I should not have come into existence because my life/environment entailed so much negatives. I think not.

Purevil,

The spokes of the rims are cracked all the way through where the rim's lip has been bent. So, I really doubt it can be repaired.

 

[Lud]

Kevin - Sorry to hear about the mishap! You've gotten some good advice on the wheels from others so I won't rehash that.

But your last comment has me a little concerned. If the wheel hit the curb hard enough to break clean through the spokes, I think there is a decent chance that you have some damage to suspension components as well.

Please make sure you have it carefully inspected by an experienced mechanic and explain to them exactly what happened. The damage can be very subtle - very slights bends or hairline fractures which, if left, can result in a very serious failure later on while the car is in motion.

 

[justin hall]

Originally posted by Lud:
But your last comment has me a little concerned. If the wheel hit the curb hard enough to break clean through the spokes, I think there is a decent chance that you have some damage to suspension components as well.

Sorry to hear about the mishap as well.

Lud is right on the money here. There is no doubt in my mind that you have done more than just wheel damage given the extent of wheel damage you talk about. Likely you have not noticed because you were either towed home or limped home at very slow speed. At a minimum you will have alignment issues, and I hope that is all, but you likely have bent some suspension components as well.

 

[nsxtasy]

Kevin,

I'm sorry to hear about your car. I hope you can get it fixed up just like new.

However, I also think it's worth noting that most (not all, but most) accidents could have been avoided by the driver. Any time someone drives too fast for conditions or for his abilities, or changes lanes on wet pavement with insufficient visibility, is taking a chance; most of the time you can luck out, but sometimes you won't. It sounds to me like this incident as well as the previous one had some causes that did not involve sheer chance. On the plus side, there is as much positive fortune in no one being hurt as there is negative fortune in the car being damaged.

You mention a lot of misfortune throughout your life and I don't mean to pooh-pooh this statement. I do believe that many people have misfortune in their lives which they suffer due to happenstance; it would be nice if everyone got as many positive breaks in life as negative ones, but it doesn't happen that way. Damage to your car can be fixed and is not really major misfortune in the scheme of things. I hope the things that DO matter turn around for you.

 

[justin hall]

Originally posted by nsxtasy:
You mention a lot of misfortune throughout your life and I don't mean to pooh-pooh this statement. I do believe that many people have misfortune in their lives which they suffer due to happenstance; it would be nice if everyone got as many positive breaks in life as negative ones, but it doesn't happen that way. Damage to your car can be fixed and is not really major misfortune in the scheme of things. I hope the things that DO matter turn around for you.

yea, I agree, there is an expression. luck is luck, you have as much good as bad in taking a larger view of your life vs. a snapshot of a particular period of time. Mentioning misfortune, I consider myself very fortunate to have the ability to own an NSX, among other things. Perhaps you can consider yourself fortunate that you were not driving a pinto when the accident occured?

 

[BladesNSX]

Lud / Justin,

The concern of my suspension was raised by my car's gaurdian angel, if you will, and he is going to check on the alignment ASAP and investigate any other possible damage.

Nsxtasy,

You cleverly worded you statement in a way that basically stated that I am an incompetant and reckless driver. Yes I was not hurt in both incidents; which I think is a result of at least some driving skill. I do believe what happened both times has alot to do with the tires I have on the back of my car. Nelson Landa himself drove my car with a fresh set of the same brand of tire on my car and we were both amazed at how poorly the tire gripped. The tire I speak of is the Pirelli P7000. Now aside from that, I suspect I am not nearly as good a driver as Nelson or others I have had the honer to meet such as Scott, Vince, and others of the FL. NSX crew. Now, as for the rainy night of the incident, what would you do? Would you have me sit behind the car going 20mph while everyone else drives by at 40-50mph. I suppose everyone else but the guy in front of me was driving recklessly. Or rather should I have parked my car and twiddled my thumbs until the rain stopped. After working a 16 hour day I wanted to get home. You cannot Pooh-pooh my statement becuase I am certian you have never experienced the things I have. I did not come here to be lectured; nor did I come for your opinion on how I should deal with the incident. I am not seeking sympathy from you either. I would suspect that after your example of (how did you put it "Gallow or BLACK humor"?) at NSXPO '00, I got up from my seat and left; as, I found your joke of poor character. If your concern is genuine then I thank you sir. If this is an attempt at a sly remark as you have done with other people who have posted a query, then you can spare me the sarcasm.

 

[Jimbo]

Kevin,

Sorry to hear about your incident and I'm glad to hear you're OK. When you wrote the following...

"...Now, as for the rainy night of the incident, what would you do? Would you have me sit behind the car going 20mph while everyone else drives by at 40-50 mph."

I suppose in retrospect, I think that would have been the thing to do.

I think the one thing we can all learn from this incident is that NSX are not the best in wet weather. The very thing that makes these cars handle so well on dry surfaces (mid-engine - low polar moment of inertia) also makes them skittish on wet roads.

I don't normally drive my NSXs or Corvette in the rain, but when I do, I creep along at speeds much less than most would consider prudent.

Jim


------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
Looking for a 76-79 Honda Accord

 

[nsxtasy]

You cleverly worded you statement in a way that basically stated that I am an incompetant and reckless driver.

No, I did not say that, my words did not imply that, and I would appreciate it if you would not twist my words around. In fact, I think that my post expressed my sympathy well for certain aspects of your situation. Unfortunately, you seem to be looking to criticize me instead of looking at the facts regarding the situations where you have gotten in trouble with your car.

My point is that every driver is responsible for driving within the limits of our abilities, the environment, our cars, etc. Sometimes we handle those responsibilities very well. From time to time, some of us don't. I've had situations myself where I used poor judgment in driving my cars, and in a couple of cases I've had minor accidents too. But when they happen, I realized that I was using poor judgment and that it was my own fault. I didn't blame the tires or the fact that it was raining when I was responsible for, and should have been, adjusting my driving to compensate for those factors. This doesn't mean (to use your words) that I am a reckless and incompetent driver; this does mean that I used poor judgment when I decided on my road speed, decided when to turn, etc. Even the best driver can make a mistake from time to time. But the very best drivers will admit the mistake and use it to learn what to do differently next time around.

It is the responsibility of the driver to know his equipment well enough to understand how not to exceed its limits. For example, if he has tires that perform poorly, he's responsible for taking turns at speeds that the tires can handle, rather than driving at the same speeds that better tires might be capable of. If the driver fails to make such an adjustment and has an accident as a result, then the cause of the accident is driver error, not sheer chance.

(OTOH if, say, a tire is properly inflated and a car is being driven at reasonable speeds and the tire blows out without any earlier sign of problems, and an accident results, this would NOT be caused by driver error, but rather by the tire failure - in other words, sheer chance from the driver's standpoint.)

Now, as for the rainy night of the incident, what would you do?

It seems that this accident had a number of causes: the darkness of driving at night; the rain which reduced the amount of traction available to your car; your decision to pull into another lane when you couldn't see whether the road ahead was clear; your impatience and frustration with driving at a slower speed while cars in other lanes are passing you; and your decision to drive your car when perhaps you were too fatigued to do so. All of these factors are things that were either within your control or were things for which you could compensate by driving in a different manner. There is no absolute "right" or "wrong" in any of these factors; any one of them might not cause a problem in and of itself. But in combination, they resulted in your accident. And, as you are pointing out, you could have avoided the accident by continuing to drive at a slower speed in your lane. It was your decision to change lanes, combined with these other factors that were within your control, that caused the accident.

Since we are asking each other questions, the question I would like to ask you is this: If you were in the exact same situation tomorrow evening, knowing now what you do, would you do anything differently?

I did not come here to be lectured; nor did I come for your opinion on how I should deal with the incident.

You presented the incident on the forums, where anyone can comment. You titled it "More Misfortune", not "Need Wheel Repair Advice". 'nuff said.

I would suspect that after your example of (how did you put it "Gallow or BLACK humor"?) at NSXPO '00, I got up from my seat and left; as, I found your joke of poor character.

I do not recall making a joke about your accident at NSXPO 2000. There were quite a number of jokes made there by others - to cite two examples that I DO remember, the improv group (not me) joked about it in their performance; and whoever determined the awards announced by Chuck Bennett (not me) gave you an award for "best use of trees as a braking device". So do not single me out as though I was the only one who had done so and blame me for the jokes that others were making. I did make a joke here on the forums in response to a comment that you had made - while apologizing at the same time for doing so. Poor taste? Sure. But perhaps, instead of being so defensive about these comments, you might consider (a) taking responsibility for that which WAS your fault and learn from it; and (b) taking the jokes in stride. Steve R. from Southern California totalled his NSX in a rollover on the highway. He is very frank about admitting exactly what he did wrong in the driver's seat that led up to the incident. And he continues to kid about it, too - he brought TURNOVER pastries to an East Coast NSX event and has been joking about it ever since. And he has never blamed his accident on bad luck.

I am truly sorry that you have incurred damage to your car. It was not, and is not, my intention to get into a hostile argument with you, here on the forums or elsewhere. It was my intention to point out that some things which we would like to blame on chance may have other causes - and that there is often much to be learned by all of us in doing so. What's the expression? "Those who refuse to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it" or something like that. I will leave this at that and this is my last post in this topic.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 08 May 2001).]

 

[BladesNSX]

Originally posted by nsxtasy:
you might consider (a) taking responsibility for that which WAS your fault and learn from it; and (b) taking the jokes in stride.
[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 08 May 2001).][/B]

This is an exact quote, so logically your words cannot be "twisted". The above quote is essentially what you intended to convey from the beginning. I am very grateful for the advice everyone provided; you guys are always very helpful. Even Hal's philosophical insight was...interesting. But again, I came for the advice not to be lectured. The next time I come across misfortune with my NSX I will be sure to take the blame for it; and, sufficiently admonish myself for it. Perhaps then you might consider offering some useful advice.

Oh and I will be sure to be as specific as possible in my title for a post.

Oh and I do apologize If I have mistaken you for someone else at NSXPO. But were you not the gentleman who spoke at the dinner that night? Who said that everyone has had a good time; all except one: namely me??

No hard feeling. I am only 25; but I certianly have alot to learn.

 

[nsxtasy]

were you not the gentleman who spoke at the dinner that night? Who said that everyone has had a good time; all except one: namely me??

I did not speak at NSXPO 2000. The speakers at the event dinners included Gary M., the Director of NSXPO 2000; Alex V., the President of the NSX Club; and Satch Carlson, the automotive journalist. Perhaps one of them made that comment.

Peace and best wishes. Over and out.

 

[nsx4jlp]

Hey Blades,
Don't listen to this guy. He obviously has nothing better to do, other than talk crap about your misfortune. Maybe (not saying I hope it happens) he will have a misfortune of his own and someone just like him will come to lecture him instead of "helping" him. Just ignore him and try the shop I mentioned above, if not email me and I know who can get you one for sure but it might take a while longer.

 

[steveny]

Blade, life is nothing but a learning experiance all the way through. I have totaled many cars looking for the edge between "The Limit" and disaster(seven to date). I am trying very hard to find that limit with my NSX and contiually take risks searching for it. This is how we all learn. I will remember your post here if I ever drive my car in the rain, hope not to. I thank you for letting me know through your post on what to be careful of in the future.

 

[Jimbo]

Speaking of driving in the rain...
http://www.nsxsc.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000271.html

Some of you might have come across this already, but I think it underscores how tricky the NSX can be to drive in the rain.

Let's all be extra careful and when it rains, drive slower than we think is necessary.

Jim

------------------
1992 NSX Red/Blk 5 spd #0330
1991 NSX Blk/Blk Auto #3070 (Sold)
1974 Vette 454 4 spd Wht/Blk
Looking for a 76-79 Honda Accord