Has anyone used these? are they noisier than an OEM Belt?
Kevlar cam belts
- Thread starter whrdnsx
- Start date
I have the Toda one. It's a belt, they don't make noise no matter what & even if they did you couldn't hear it over the engine. Why would a belt be noisy? What it drives could conceivably, but that would likely be due to overtensioning or a bad bearing in the rotating part of whatever it drives.
shawn110975
Suspended
I think what he is really asking will it last longer than an OEM belt.
NO it will last as long as a regular belt. maybe a little longer but who wants to take that risk? change belts when the time has come.
even if its a Kevlar-Carbon-Tungston-Diamond-NASA made thing-a-ma-bobber belt
NO it will last as long as a regular belt. maybe a little longer but who wants to take that risk? change belts when the time has come.
even if its a Kevlar-Carbon-Tungston-Diamond-NASA made thing-a-ma-bobber belt
I agree with Shawn that you should replace the belt at the recommended intervals, but if you have a high performance engine (lots of mods turbo/supercharger) or if you spend a lot of time in the high rpms (track) these stronger belts offer just a little bit more insurance than the OEM unit.
Someone needs to figure out how to convert the dam belt into a chain and be done with it.....
Well considering the weight and the rotational dynamic changes it would be quite an undertaking. But be awesome if someone researched this age old problem.
Who wants BATMANs to fund the research? Raise your hands! :biggrin:
Negative ghostrider..... the pattern's full.
And how many belt failures have we seen that would drive this???
Just change your damn belt.
Just change your damn belt.
How bout a steel belted radial belt? Worked for tires, wouldn't stretch but would probably eat itself at high rpm's. You know they could do it if they wanted to. That's what gripes me.
Pretty sure kevlar belts are light years ahead of any steel belt concept. The steel in tires goes through some flexing with tire deflection with each rotation or cycle. Imagine the intense flexing that the steel belt would go through with each cycle of the timing belt. What is good for tires may not be for belts. Kevlar does not stretch as much as metal either.
Well that wouldn't be that hard just matter of calculating timing and tensioning.
BUT! lubrication and related parts are going to add to the complexity and weight not to mention price.
I'm suprised more people here are'nt using these. I'll probably consider one when the time comes.
shawn110975
Suspended
I know someone that could make the damn belt into a chain.
hint #1
he is a mechanical engineer
hint #2
he fixed the NSX windows flaw.
hint #3
he does not live in the USA.
.......I would pay top dollar for this ultimate Mod.......
hint #1
he is a mechanical engineer
hint #2
he fixed the NSX windows flaw.
hint #3
he does not live in the USA.
.......I would pay top dollar for this ultimate Mod.......
Ahh Portugal!
I though about doing that conversion on mine before i replaced the TB belt and water pump,
But it ain't worth it (not with the miles i do)
The risk vs reward ratio is too high to extend the maintenance interval. I think that's why nobody has bothered.
It's not like the stock hasn't been able to run well beyond the stock interval or power levels.
[edit] Now if somebody could show that these things age better than OEM (ie 10yrs / 100k miles), that would be something. There are a lot of cars that aren't driven much but require service because the belt ages
It's not like the stock hasn't been able to run well beyond the stock interval or power levels.
[edit] Now if somebody could show that these things age better than OEM (ie 10yrs / 100k miles), that would be something. There are a lot of cars that aren't driven much but require service because the belt ages
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I would like some lab testing done on these belts to see how long they can last. I wonder if this can be done.
We hear so much about hypothetical failures and how long we think they will last, but without hard evidence to prove it.
We hear so much about hypothetical failures and how long we think they will last, but without hard evidence to prove it.
Brian was selling some of these...not sure anymore. Here is an old thread with some data on the Kevlar Belt.
http://nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113553
http://nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php?t=113553
The reason why i asked was I build a lot of GTR engines & anytime we use a Kevlar Belt, "Gate's Racing belts" to be exact are as noisy as hell. you's swear a bearing was gone it's that bad. even going looser or tighter has so effect.
I'm about to fit a Power enterprise belt & just wanted to make sure it wasn't going to be noisy.
Thanks
We have these in stock:
http://scienceofspeed.com/products/engine_performance_products/NSX/Power_Enterprise/Timing_Belt/
A couple notes:
- We've installed several of these, there is no noticeable noise difference between the factory belt.
- The Toda belt is made by Power (the Power belt is less expensive).
- The factory belt is a very good design - and has proven itself to be durable when changed at factory recommended intervals. The primary difference between the two is nylon strands (factory) vs. Kevlar strands in the tooth construction and the tension cord construction.
- We do not recommend extending the change interval when using this belt compared to the factory belt - as there are other components that require inspection/replacement other than the belt - such as the water pump, oil pump, and tensioner pulley/bearing.
- The intended use is targeting the race user where the extra $80-100 is worth the nth increase in durability where the frequency of sudden engine speed changes will increase where the factory belt may be more prone to stretching or vibration which may change cam timing or result in the belt coming off the gears. For this reason, we also recommend changing the tensioner to a locking type:
http://scienceofspeed.com/products/engine_performance_products/NSX/ScienceofSpeed/tensioner/
-- Chris
http://scienceofspeed.com/products/engine_performance_products/NSX/Power_Enterprise/Timing_Belt/
A couple notes:
- We've installed several of these, there is no noticeable noise difference between the factory belt.
- The Toda belt is made by Power (the Power belt is less expensive).
- The factory belt is a very good design - and has proven itself to be durable when changed at factory recommended intervals. The primary difference between the two is nylon strands (factory) vs. Kevlar strands in the tooth construction and the tension cord construction.
- We do not recommend extending the change interval when using this belt compared to the factory belt - as there are other components that require inspection/replacement other than the belt - such as the water pump, oil pump, and tensioner pulley/bearing.
- The intended use is targeting the race user where the extra $80-100 is worth the nth increase in durability where the frequency of sudden engine speed changes will increase where the factory belt may be more prone to stretching or vibration which may change cam timing or result in the belt coming off the gears. For this reason, we also recommend changing the tensioner to a locking type:
http://scienceofspeed.com/products/engine_performance_products/NSX/ScienceofSpeed/tensioner/
-- Chris
what no replies , jeezzes i figured you guys would be all over this :smile:
Im sorry, but that is just unreadable. Worst run on sentence in history. I would lecture a 5yo for such unforgivable grammar.
Do not be sorry and please do not lecture a 5yo. In my professional opinion, our cars are better of with a belt than a chain. Can you read this?
If you look at the Power Enterprise website (http://www.powerenterpriseusa.net/products/engine/timing_belt/timing_belt.htm), the Kevlar reinforces the teeth of the belt. Presumably that makes the teeth more resistant to damage from dirt or grit if you run an open cam belt without a cover over it. “Special glass cords” are what prevent the belt from stretching.
Power Enterprise state that their cam belts are four times more “durable against stretching compared to the stock belts.” I wonder whether that’s compared to all cam belts or just to some, how much the Power Enterprise belt stretches compared to a stock NSX timing belt, and what reinforces the stock NSX belt to prevent it from stretching. Also “special glass cords”?
Power Enterprise state that their cam belts are four times more “durable against stretching compared to the stock belts.” I wonder whether that’s compared to all cam belts or just to some, how much the Power Enterprise belt stretches compared to a stock NSX timing belt, and what reinforces the stock NSX belt to prevent it from stretching. Also “special glass cords”?
Do not be sorry and please do not lecture a 5yo. In my professional opinion, our cars are better of with a belt than a chain. Can you read this?
Lol. Yes, since you decided to use a period. A 5yo will be spared and he has you to thank for it.
I have the Power timing belt as well as Grant serpentine belts. They may not be the same but it isn't noticeable to the naked eye. They are in a box so I can take photos if you like.
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