Is this review of the TL accurate at all?

[NsXMas]

I was browsing reviews for the Acura TL, and came across this recent review.

Is this review accurate or is it full of hot air? I know nothing about the TL and would appreciate some clarification from fellow Acura owners. :smile:

"Junkbox Honda TL - A Crude Noseheavy Whale"
2006 Acura TL 6-Spd MT w/ Performance Tires
03/16/2006
By: Hiroshi Miyagi >_<
Owned: Less than 1 year
Review ID: #488393
2.6 Overall Rating

2 Styling
3 Performance
3 Interior
4 Quality
2 Recommendation



Pros:
Decent plain-jane sedan built on the Honda Accord chassis using generic Honda mechanicals and components. Peppy little Honda motor runs greener than more powerful engines... Too bad Honda got caught lying about its power ratings last year when they were forced to comply with the SAE standards used by the rest of the industry. Now, instead of conjuring up inflated fake power ratings, Honda has to abide by the rules! Hence the reason why the TL went from 270 to 258HP even though the engine is exactly the same. Funny how none of the European brands had that problem. Just goes to show you the great lengths to which Japanese companies will go to deceive their customers in order to make a profit.


Cons:
From the transmission to the door handles, the TL uses the same components and mechanicals as its lesser priced Honda siblings like Civic. Even the chassis and drivetrain is taken from the Accord parts bin. Anonymous Honda exterior styling and a cramped interior. Lacks advanced safety features like rear belt tensioners, rear force limiters, rear side airbags, sensor for post-impact fuel shutoff and starter disconnect, interlocking door anchors, transverse floor beams, strong seats that resist collapse in rear impacts, active head restraints, etc. Also, instead of costly high strength steel like the Europeans, Honda uses cheaper "mild" steel in critical areas like the roof pillars on the TL.


Overall Review:
Acceleration in a straight line is adequate, but the Honda TL is a FWD nightmare. The only thing worse than the atrocious torque steer is its crude, unbalanced chassis. Driving the TL around a track is unsettling. You have to fight to keep this car in line because of its poor weight distribution and tendency to plow out suddenly in abrupt understeer skids. The 3 and A3 are poised and balanced in comparison. Honda's VSA system is also poorly designed. It allows too much lateral slip and it activates abruptly and less effectively than seamless systems like DSC. Furthermore, the Accord-based structure flexes and quivers. This can be felt and also heard in the groans and creaks of the chassis. Mushy brakes are similarly disappointing. In typical Honda fashion, the TL takes a chart topping 189ft to brake from 70... 20ft more than European rivals and even some SUVs! Add all this corner cutting and poor performance together and you get a genuine Honda wearing a plastic "Acura" logo.

 

[Dewain27]

The power rating is correct, but my wife owns one and it is an awesome car...

 

[DONYMO]

We have one and we love it.

 

[NsXMas]

I'm concerned about the specific safety features that the reviewer mentions is lacking. Does anyone know if it's true or bullshit?

It's funny he mentions taking it on the track, which I have no plans of doing. But the some things mentioned in the review is somewhat of a concern if true.

 

[dave22]

I wouldn't worry about that review. That guy obviously has a chip on his shoulder.

Have you seen any other reviews this bad?

 

[nsxtasy]

No, it's not accurate at all. This guy is an ass.

The standards for reporting horsepower were changed last year and apply to all manufacturers, not just Honda. Some models have seen horsepower ratings increase, while others have decreased.

The TL has been generally lauded in the automotive press, along with a few negatives directed at its FWD layout. The comments in the March 2005 comparison of $35,000 sedans in Car and Driver (click here), in which the Acura finished third (to Infiniti and BMW, and beat Audi, Jaguar, Lexus, and Saab), are typical:

"Acura was clearly planning to take no prisoners with the latest TL, and that was immediately apparent at the drag strip, where the TL ripped off a 0-to-60-mph mark of just 5.8 seconds—a half-second quicker than the potent Infiniti G35 could manage with its 3.5-liter V-6, and more than a second quicker than the best of the rest.

Equipped with Acura's VTEC system, the TL's broad torque spread was equally impressive. Along with the mega-motor came a slick-shifting six-speed transmission and purposeful—almost sinister-looking—exterior styling. Inside, we found a roomy cabin with high-grade materials and legible instrumentation. The message was clear: This car has the goods to kick ass in this category.

But then we went marauding in the mountains north of Los Angeles and discovered some other TL traits. The combination of big power, front-wheel drive, and a limited-slip differential produces quite a bit of tugging at the steering wheel as the front wheels encounter varying surfaces. This is exacerbated by the TL's peculiar suspension tuning. The car is simultaneously firm yet springy, and the front suspension felt as if it were topping out over certain road crests, whereupon it would produce a big weave as it touched back down.

We also experienced some twitchy head-tossing motions on bumpy surfaces from the TL's spring and anti-roll-bar interactions. Acura engineers obviously sought a compromise between ride comfort and body-motion control, and the side effect is some spooky rough-road responses. But hit the smooth highway, and the picture changes. Here the TL is at home, the chassis feels well damped and controlled, and you can enjoy the precise, nicely weighted steering and excellent throttle response. Also, you might want to try the eight-speaker, DVD-compatible ELS audio system. It kicks.

Acura TLs equipped with the manual six-speed also get beautiful Brembo four-piston front-brake calipers, and these contributed to the shortest stopping distance of the pack—160 feet from 70 mph, with a firm pedal feel that garnered a second-highest rating on the chart. Still, one of the logbook entries accused the brakes of feeling weak during high-spirited driving. There's just no satisfying some of our editors.

Here's where that integration of comfort and dynamic ability counts. The TL boasts the largest, best-furnished interior, the strongest engine, one of the slickest shifters, exemplary build quality, and generally superior esthetics. A pity its front-drive layout falls short of perfection."

They said much the same thing in their road test of the car in January 2004, when it came out. Articles in other publications came to similar conclusions.

It's also worth noting that the TL costs $5-10K less than competing models, when equipped comparably. (The TL includes as standard equipment items such as HID lighting, sunroof, and leather, most of which cost extra on other brands.)

 

[caz-nsx]

Sounds like a guy that paid $40k+ for a BMW 3 series and is trying to justify his actions.

 

[DocL]

I've had my Tl for 15 months and it hasn't given me one problem. Yes there is a bit of torque steer, but nothing like the SHO's that I've owned. The ride is firm, and the handling is crisp. The TL is by no means a sports car, it behaves like a sedan for $31k should. You can't find any other car in it's price range with all of the standard options. The TL has spoiled me. I can't live without the built in XM radio and Bluetooth hands-free-link. Everytime I think of trading it in for a G35 coupe I can't do it. The only regret that I have with my purchase of the TL is not getting it in 6spd. But at the time I bought it I was married and didn't want to be selfish by having three manual transmission cars for myself. (I should have been more selfish and not so compromising. )

I suggest that you test drive one and see if you like it. I just had an '06 TL on loaner while mine was being serviced, and the only thing that I didn't like was the blue background of the radio and a/c. Oh yeah, the '06 now comes with a tire pressure monitoring system. It was neat watching the pressures increase after I was taking the on/off ramps.:biggrin:

 

[nsxtasy]

I'm concerned about the specific safety features that the reviewer mentions is lacking. Does anyone know if it's true or bullshit?

The Acura TL received Consumer Reports' highest rating for crash protection, and is their top pick among $30-40K sedans. What does that tell you?

Again, this guy is an ass with a chip on his shoulder...

 

[Da Hapa]

I recently had a 2005 TL with NAV and XM radio as a loaner car for the better part of two weeks and I came away with some very strong impressions. Please keep in mind this was a loaner car and as I've noticed with all the loaner cars I've had (Lexus or Acura), these things get beat up like hell because people, in general, are pigs and they treat these cars like crap. So take my thoughts with that it mind.

1) Great motor. Good low end torque, great high end zing, and it sounds good.
2) Good packaging. It's a lot of car in such a small space and the passenger compartment is good sized and the trunk is useful and also large.
3) Good ride. The ride isn't too stiff and isn't too soft. Much better than the loaner ES330 I had a few weeks back but not as good as a BMW 3 series.
4) Lot of features but some interesting content choices. At the price point, the moonroof, leather, HID's, XM radio, NAV, etc. are all a great value. But why are the front windows the only ones that are one touch up and down? Weird, I thought.
5) Torque steer like nobody's business. Granted, I had an auto version and I believe the MT has a LSD that quells some torque steer but it was pretty bad in the AT.
6) Cheap interior items. Granted, the car had an all in MSRP of the mid $30's but whereas the ES330 has a beautiful interior with high quality plastics and wood, the TL had a drab, dark interior with fake aluminum and cheap, hard plastics.
7) Squeeks and rattles. The car was quite quiet on the freeway except for all the squeeks and rattles. I would be easily convinced that some of this was due to a loaner car but I was shocked at how much I ended up turning up the stereo to drown out unwanted noise.
8) Great nav. system. Honestly, it's more intuitive than the unit in my LX470 which costs twice as much.

 

[Tantheman]

Consumer Report best buy sedan over $30K.

 

[nsxtasy]

Consumer Report best buy sedan over $30K.

Really??? I could swear I've heard that before...

The Acura TL received Consumer Reports' highest rating for crash protection, and is their top pick among $30-40K sedans.

4) Lot of features but some interesting content choices. At the price point, the moonroof, leather, HID's, XM radio, NAV, etc. are all a great value. But why are the front windows the only ones that are one touch up and down? Weird, I thought.

That's undoubtedly a design decision regarding usability, not a cost decision. I think it makes sense NOT to have a one-touch function on the rear windows, which are less likely to be used full up or down by the driver, and for which a one-touch may not make sense (so as not to catch a finger or arm of a rear-seat occupant who is out of the driver's line of sight). You can argue which way makes the most sense, but I really doubt that this had anything to do with cost.

 

[Da Hapa]

That's undoubtedly a design decision regarding usability, not a cost decision. I think it makes sense NOT to have a one-touch function on the rear windows, which are less likely to be used full up or down by the driver, and for which a one-touch may not make sense (so as not to catch a finger or arm of a rear-seat occupant who is out of the driver's line of sight). You can argue which way makes the most sense, but I really doubt that this had anything to do with cost.

I don't know Ken... the one touch windows in our other cars have pinch protection which would probably preclude any mishaps and I don't know for sure, but I'd be shocked if the more expensive RL doesn't have one touch windows for all four windows with some sort of pinch protection.

 

[apple27]

Probably just a competitor trying to scare people away. My wife has one and although I barely drive it I think its a great car for the money.

 

[BD]

Some one should report this guy to msn

 

[4AU4LIFE]

We have an 04 auto. Couldn't be happier with it.

 

[NsXMas]

Thanks for the feedback all. Will have to go check out the Type S with brembo brakes.

 

[nsxtasy]

Will have to go check out the Type S with brembo brakes.

Only if you're looking at a used one. The Type S had the higher horsepower (260 hp) of the two versions of the previous-generation TL (1999-2003, although the Type S was only available for 2002-2003). There is no longer a Type S; the current generation TL (2004-present) has only one engine (258 hp). There's basically one version, although the various permutations of the factory options (manual vs automatic, standard vs performance tires, and nav system) create six versions of equipment as they come from the factory.

EDIT: The six-speed TL has the Brembo front brake rotors; the automatic does not.

EDIT: Changed wording because the current generation TL is the third generation.

 

[NsXMas]

Aw shucks. Thanks Ken for the info.

 

[NsSeX]

Only if you're looking at a used one. The Type S had the higher horsepower (260 hp) of the two versions of the first-generation TL (1999-2003). There is no longer a Type S; the second generation TL (2004-present) has only one engine (258 hp) and they all have the same big brake setup. There's basically one version, although the various permutations of the factory options (manual vs automatic, standard vs performance tires, and nav system) create six versions of equipment as they come from the factory.

Only the six-speed TL comes with the brembo front calipers:tongue: :biggrin:

NsXmas, I would recommend staying away from the pervious gen Tl's. I'm not sure if Honda redesigned the current Tl's drivetrain, but the previous gen Tl's had major transmission issues. My brother's old CL S's transmission(same tranny used by previous gen TL S) croaked every 15k miles:wink:

 

[NsXMas]

Thanks for the info, NsSex.

 

[nsxtasy]

Only the six-speed TL comes with the brembo front calipers:tongue: :biggrin:

You are correct, sir. I will go edit my post and then stand in the corner.

From Acura's website:

Front Rotors:
Automatic: Ventilated, 11.8 in. (300 mm) diameter; 1.1 in. (28 mm) rotor thickness
Manual: Brembo® ventilated, 12.2 in. (310 mm) diameter; 0.98 in. (25 mm) rotor thickness

Rear Rotors:
Solid, 11.1 in. (282 mm) diameter; 0.35 in. (9 mm) rotor thickness

 

[NetViper]

Here is my take. That guy is a moron.

1) The HP thing Ken already explained, but this guy was too stupid to even notice that.

2) If you are buying this car to go on a track, you are buying the wrong car.

THe TL is a great car. I like ours a lot. The only reason I want to sell it is because of the terrible service our acura dealer provides.

 

[Acura NsX Pilot]

Only if you're looking at a used one. The Type S had the higher horsepower (260 hp) of the two versions of the first-generation TL (1999-2003). There is no longer a Type S; the second generation TL (2004-present) has only one engine (258 hp). There's basically one version, although the various permutations of the factory options (manual vs automatic, standard vs performance tires, and nav system) create six versions of equipment as they come from the factory.

EDIT: The six-speed TL has the Brembo front brake rotors; the automatic does not.

Correction there was never a Type S offered on the first gen and the second gen did not offer a Type S till 2001 I belive. Also if you check the stopping distance between the auto and manual with the Brembo brakes you will find that the auto stops faster in the shorter distance. I had a 02 Type S for three years and now have a 06 TL as my daily. The transmission data is tru for all second gen model TL's especially the Type S version, dealers have a TSB on it. I went thru three tranny's on my 02 lease before returning it for a new 06 lease. I dont think anyone can find a more optioned out car for this kind of money.

 

[NsSeX]

You are correct, sir. I will go edit my post and then stand in the corner.

From Acura's website:

Front Rotors:
Automatic: Ventilated, 11.8 in. (300 mm) diameter; 1.1 in. (28 mm) rotor thickness
Manual: Brembo® ventilated, 12.2 in. (310 mm) diameter; 0.98 in. (25 mm) rotor thickness

Rear Rotors:
Solid, 11.1 in. (282 mm) diameter; 0.35 in. (9 mm) rotor thickness

I finally caught you making a mistake!:tongue: :biggrin: