I hate my Nsx antilock brakes! Disable?

[ffffanman]

I really dislike the antilock brakes on my 91 Nsx.
I feel it could have caused me a to loose the nose off my car yesterday if I hadn't reacted in time or should I say predicted what the truck might do.
Also there have been previous situations that also make me dislike the system.
Does anyone know how to disable the antilock brakes simply.
Detailed instructions would be muchly appreciated and pictures are always good.

Thanks so much!
Trev

 

[NSXDreamer2]

easy, pull the ebrake lightly just enough to get the ebrake lights on your dash light up. Drag it until the ABS light light up, release your e-brake, now your won't have ABS. It's universal for all Honda/acura.

I don't like my ABS at first, but after getting new pads and rotors and also being on track with more aggresvie pads. I don't hate the ABS anymore. Most likely, it's the TCS or bad pads giving you the weird feelings.

Also, compare to most other cars, the nsx doesn't nose dive as much, and that will give driver a false feeling that the car was gliding instead of stopping. Go get a deserted parking lot, try some panic braking with/without ABS, if possible do that to the other cars you have... You will agree that your nsx braking is not bad, at all.

 

[NSX-Racer]

AFAIK this method is just for the time you didn't shut off the engine. ABS is back again when you start the car again, right?

If you want to turn off ABS (which is much better at later model years)forever you can pull 2 fuses in the fuse box under the front hood - no pic necessary - the ABS fuses are described on the underside of the box cover.

 

[nsxtasy]

compare to most other cars, the nsx doesn't nose dive as much, and that will give driver a false feeling that the car was gliding instead of stopping. Go get a deserted parking lot, try some panic braking with/without ABS, if possible do that to the other cars you have... You will agree that your nsx braking is not bad, at all.

Yes, exactly. The advantage of ABS is not so much in shortening stopping distances, as it is in the ability to maintain steering control while breaking. Particularly in a panic stop, when the natural tendency is to slam on the brake pedal, ABS may prevent your car from sliding or swerving in an unintended direction. I think ABS is a great technology and I would never disable mine.

If you really want to see what ABS can do, I highly recommend NSXDreamer2's recommendation to try it in a deserted parking lot - especially at a time when that deserted parking lot is wet. It will give you a much greater appreciation of how ABS can help.

 

[ffffanman]

Thanks for all the good feedback boys!
I love the Nsx brakes, not the Anti part!
On smooth dry roads, I have no problem with what I got, but on what I have to drive on up here, look out.
I'm going to do some parking lot stuff, that sounds like fun and a smart thing to do. Get to know your car better, that can't hurt.
Here is a photo under my hood. It has three fuse boxes labeled A,B & C by me. Which is the box with the two fuses I must pull in? For some reason my box B has a French sticker inside and nothing outside. Anyone else have this?
Can someone point out the two fuses to pull.
Thanks once again.
Trev

 

[NSX-Racer]

It's box B, the two 20 A ALB fuses.

 

[ffffanman]

WOW, thanks!
ALB 1,4 and ALB 2,3 is coming out.
If you don't hear from me again, its cause I shouldn't have taken them out!
Thanks all!
Trev
Humm, I wonder if I replace them with 10 amps, then they wont react as much, yeah thats it! Also, which wheel is 1 and which is 3. Do they start at the drivers front and go clockwise? Just wondering.

 

[docjohn]

Let us know what you think,I ran half a season of track events years ago with the abs fuse pulled,and after awhile felt there was little benefit,so the rather crude (by todays standards) abs is back.

 

[LJSB]

WOW, thanks!
Humm, I wonder if I replace them with 10 amps, then they wont react as much, yeah thats it!

I'm going to guess you're not trying to be funny and let you know changing the fuse size will not cut the effect of ABS down or in half. If the circuit demands more than 10 amps it will just blow the fuse, that's all.

Do they start at the drivers front and go clockwise? Just wondering.

No. Read this: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/anti-lock-brake.htm

 

[NSX-Racer]

pbassjo: Don't take all the things he wrote too serious - I'm pretty sure he was joking - If I would have had the time yesterday I would have also wrote in my answer that if he has a french sticker inside the fuse box B he has to watch for frogs and snails in boxes A and C :biggrin:

 

[AU_NSX]

It is a known fact that ABS extends your braking distance considerably on snow and gravel roads and should be disconnected when in thoses conditions!

It should also be disconnected on the race track. The reason you should disconnect at the track is because I have seen 2 cars now totalled by impacting the concrete walls when the "kitty litter" fails to arrest the vehicle. The ABS prevents the wheels locking and allowed the cars to travel (or skim is probably a better word) across the sand trap to hit the concrete wall.

This was on HPDE days so experienced drivers like docjohn with loads of track time will probably know how to turn the wheel to get the wheels to "bite" into the kitty-litter but lesser mortals just jump on the brakes and hope for the best. With ABS on your car will continue to travel right accross the trap (unless you are traveling sideways of course). If your wheels are allowed to lock, the kitty litter does its job of building up in front of the wheels and stopping the car.

My belief is if you disconnect the ABS on the road... The one time you do have a panic stop and you really need the ABS to cut in to give you some control... You turned it off... and well you know the rest...

 

[LJSB]

It is a known fact that ABS extends your braking distance considerably on snow and gravel roads and should be disconnected when in thoses conditions!

Shows you how stupid I am. I didn't know it snowed in Australia. :redface:

As for the above statement on ABS it may slightly increase your braking distance(note I said may) in soft unpacked snow or gravel but the benefit of being in control of the vehicle's steering and keeping it straight gives you a better chance of getting around or out of trouble.
On slippery roads in general it will decrease your stopping distance.

 

[ffffanman]

So I pulled the two fuses and both the TCS and ABS idiot lights come on.
Did I just also disable my TCS?
If so, I wouldn't want that.
If so, Any way around this?
Thanks so much!
Trev
p.s. Just fooling around on the 10 amp thingy, sorry!

 

[nsxtasy]

Shows you how stupid I am. I didn't know it snowed in Australia. :redface:

Neither did I. In July, in the middle of the winter, the average high temperature in Sydney is 63 degrees F.

 

[AU_NSX]

Shows you how stupid I am. I didn't know it snowed in Australia. :redface:

Neither did I. In July, in the middle of the winter, the average high temperature in Sydney is 63 degrees F.

I'm Actually surprised some American's even know Australia exists.... Most tend to think Australia is a little country in Europe next to Germany ...

I've worked out that American's generally become aware of a countries existence only after they have bombed it.... :biggrin:

So, Australia does have snow... Not as much as that little country in Europe next to Germany... But enough to have a healthy skiing and snowboarding industry.... Oh and the worlds No 1 freestyle skier! :wink:

That's why Australia is such a fantastic place... We have everything here! You can be skiing in the snowy Mountains and then jump on a plane and be snorkelling off a tropical island in the Great Barrier Reef 3 hours later.

We don't get snow in the cities though... Only in the alpine regions. That is where your confusion stems...

So you are all forgiven.... :biggrin: And now a little bit wiser! :wink:

 

[AU_NSX]

As for the above statement on ABS it may slightly increase your braking distance(note I said may) in soft unpacked snow or gravel but the benefit of being in control of the vehicle's steering and keeping it straight gives you a better chance of getting around or out of trouble.
On slippery roads in general it will decrease your stopping distance.

Yes and no.

Given that Australia has so many dirt and gravel roads, a plethora of tests have been done on how to drive on gravel roads.

It has been proven that to minimise stopping distance on a loose surface you must lock the wheels so the tyres can push the loose material out of the way so the tyre can contact the firm material underneath.

In snow, the same situation, but the tyres will act like a plough and push the snow forward whilst the tyres contact the road pavement underneath.

These are facts about stopping distances only!

Tests to verify the above have been performed by numerous magazines and road safety authorities in Australia as most cars on Australian roads have ABS now. However most do not travel outside the cities either. Their advice is to always use ABS on sealed roads and switch ABS off on unsealed roads. (note that their advice to leave ABS ON when driving in snow on a sealed road, and off if it is unsealed. Some of our alpine roads previously were unsealed leading to some ski fields.)

The advice to switch ABS off on unsealed roads is because the No 1 hazard on country unsealed roads is not avoiding another vehicle but wildlife on the road. The situation of a kangaroo jumping out in front of you whilst on an unsealed road.... Your instinct is to slam on the brakes and then turn the wheel. Locking the wheels ensures you slide forward and hit the kangaroo in a straight line. You should be okay. If you had ABS activated, your wheels would not lock and when you turned the wheel the car would change direction and impact the kangaroo at some angle of incidence causing the car to be deflected off the road and more than likely rolling over.

This seems to be a unique situation existing in Australia caused by the speed at which kangaroo's travel and usually in numbers such that if you miss one you will in all probability hit another. They usually travel at night abut not always, and are easily startled by headlights (They freeze when a light is shone on them at night)

Now I do agree with you pbassjo on the benefits of ABS and I never take my car in the snow or off sealed roads and therefore keep ABS on all the time when driving on public roads.

But I do switch it off on the race track in case I overshoot a corner at the end of a straight and end up in the "kitty litter" where I want the tyres to act like a bulldozer and push as much material in front of me to arrest the vehicle. With ABS on.... The tyres would be allowed to keep rolling across the top of the "kitty litter" preventing the vehicle from slowing down and possibly impacting the concrete or tyre wall on the other side as I have seen some do....

 

[NSX-Racer]

If it only would be so easy to "switch off" the ABS in the NSX - which it apparently isn't (and in other cars I know there's also no such switch). I always leave ABS on at the track because I have problems to feel the point where the race slicks start to block (much harder than with normal tires - you hear no squeal, you only see the smoke and then it's too late).

 

[AU_NSX]

If it only would be so easy to "switch off" the ABS in the NSX - which it apparently isn't (and in other cars I know there's also no such switch).

Yes... I'm glad you brought that up! It is also an observation made by the motoring journalists down here... German cars are apparently the hardest to "switch" ABS off! (comparing family sedans like Mercedes vs our locally made Commodores and Falcons) It seems pulling the fuse as discussed above is the only way.

But I wish it was easier in the NSX also! But if they did put a switch in it would probably be like the TCS switch which doesn't totally switch TCS off!

To "Permanently" switch of the TCS you have to unplug the TCS at the throttle body as the dash switch does not completely disconnect the TCS. It will switch itself back on and cut all fuel to the engine if it detects sustained wheel spin for 4 seconds....

I had a bad experience when the TCS switched itself back on during a sustained high speed over steer situation... It caused me to spin violently off the track. Luckily I didn't hit anything and the only damage was my ego and a dusty car....

 

[AU_NSX]

I always leave ABS on at the track because I have problems to feel the point where the race slicks start to block (much harder than with normal tires - you hear no squeal, you only see the smoke and then it's too late).

I'm not that good.... I'm still using street tyres and attending HPDE days!

When someone gets to your level of racing you would probably be calm enough to think to turn the steering wheel or something to get the tyres dig in if your ABS is activated. Amatures like me could panic and not think properly when their pride and joy is heading uncontrolled at a concrete wall...

It has not happened to me (thankfully)... I am just following the instructors advice for now...

 

[NSX-Racer]

To "Permanently" switch of the TCS you have to unplug the TCS at the throttle body as the dash switch does not completely disconnect the TCS. It will switch itself back on and cut all fuel to the engine if it detects sustained wheel spin for 4 seconds....

That's the 1st time I hear that - never seen such an experience here on Prime nor did I experience it myself - is that something special for a model year or country?

 

[SugrueNSX]

I'm Actually surprised some American's even know Australia exists.... Most tend to think Australia is a little country in Europe next to Germany ...

I've worked out that American's generally become aware of a countries existence only after they have bombed it.... :biggrin:

So, Australia does have snow... Not as much as that little country in Europe next to Germany... But enough to have a healthy skiing and snowboarding industry.... Oh and the worlds No 1 freestyle skier! :wink:

That's why Australia is such a fantastic place... We have everything here! You can be skiing in the snowy Mountains and then jump on a plane and be snorkelling off a tropical island in the Great Barrier Reef 3 hours later.

We don't get snow in the cities though... Only in the alpine regions. That is where your confusion stems...

So you are all forgiven.... :biggrin: And now a little bit wiser! :wink:

Nice post! Very funny.
Sadly all true. I have a London (That’s in England which is in Europe) :smile: accent and I was in 7-11 a few days ago and the guy behind the counter says “Where are you from Australia?” and I say “No England” and he says “well I was close”. Anyway thanks for the geography lesson Bruce!

Regards,

Patrick

 

[AU_NSX]

That's the 1st time I hear that - never seen such an experience here on Prime nor did I experience it myself - is that something special for a model year or country?

You're right... It is not a well known fact. Although some Honda technicians here (ex HK) are aware of it...

It is nothing special as far as I know... Our cars in Australia are the same as the UK ones... So European Spec.

I also don't know if it only happens above a certain speed either? It is part of the TCS ECU programming.

Having said that, 4 seconds is a very long time to be in a drift.... I don't know of anyone else that has done that at speed. And I only did it by accident!

I entered a (LH) 3rd gear corner too fast and the car started to over steer. I tried to keep a constant throttle but actually was accelerating slightly. The car was very sideways but I had enough correction dialled in. The car maintained a "drift" until I was just about through the corner and the TCS suddenly cut in and had the effect of a sudden lift-off the accelerator. The car then spun 6-7 times in an anti-clock ways direction.

I was perplexed about this for some time... During the "Drift" I had that much correction on that I knew if the back end gripped suddenly I would find it very hard (even with power steering!) to catch it and would in all probability spin in a clockwise direction. But that did not happen... The back end never had the chance to grip... I did not let off the accelerator as I knew that would induce a spin in the anti-clockwise direction. The engine cut out or died due to the TCS and I did indeed spin in an anti-clockwise direction.

I only became aware of the TCS issue whilst talking to a guy racing an NSX here in Australia when I asked him why he had unplugged a particular plug from the throttle body (I did not know it was for the TCS at that stage). He said that the TCS would re-activate itself if it detected a slide of more than 4 seconds...

I have heard this from word of mouth and Honda Technicians but I have not actually seen any documentation on it...

 

[LJSB]

More on Australia. Is the population disproportionately female?
Sorry to come off as a dummy but I thought there were many more woman than men.

How's the crime rate?

Too many snakes, bugs and critters for me and that STEVE. Something please nail him and shut him up!

 

[nsxtasy]

If it only would be so easy to "switch off" the ABS in the NSX - which it apparently isn't

Yes, it is. Just pull up one or two clicks on the parking brake, until the warning light on the dash comes on. Then ABS is disabled until the car is turned off.

 

[Dave Hardy]

If pulling the fuse has the desired effect, then a switch could be added to the fused circuit that would have the same effect.