Help w/Best Track/Street Tires Thread for 16"/17" Wheels???

[kjcemo]

Seize the moment. Can anyone tell me what discussion I should be looking at for my specific application? I need to replace my Falken Azenis RT-615's with a stickier rubber. Great tires for the money but I am lusting for a little faster lap times and still be able to use them for limited mileage on the street. Tires need to fit 16x7 and 17x8 wheels.

Has this topic been covered recently? Please let me know.

 

[kjcemo]

Okay..............if this HAS NOT BEEN DISCUSSED can anyone suggest which tires are the latest/greatest for my application?

Their are so many tire choices out there........... I am trying to cut down on the research time since my next track event is April 30 at Thunderhill. Any help would be appreciated!

 

[W]

Check out the Kumho XS. It will definitely be a little bit faster than the Falkens. It'll also feel great because you're stepping up from heat cycled out Falkens which are pretty bad when done. You might also want to explore the possibility of r-compound tires, like the R888's or A048's which come in 16/17 friendly sizes. BTW, are your rear wheels 17x8 or was that a typo?

 

[kjcemo]

Okay.......... they are 17x8.5.

I checked out the specs and pricing on the Kumho Ecsta XS. My pocketbook says yes since they are in the same price range as my Falkens where. I am still curious about the Spec's, AD08's and the RE-11's on the NSX. Tire Racks testing puts all 4 in the same ballpark in the dry tests. However I would have to go with 225/50x16's on the front. I am waiting for an answer to that possibility on a Tire and Wheel thread.

 

[W]

However I would have to go with 225/50x16's on the front.

Personally, I might try it just for the sake of it if I already had the tires/wheels laying around but I wouldn't suggest someone go out and buy it. Why compromise your setup when you already have a perfectly good XS option?

If you're going to run 225/50/16 fronts, you may as well just get 17" front wheels and run 235/40/17's.

 

[Scin]

You may want to check out the Hankook RS-3's. GRM was out testing tires at our local track and were testing RS-3's as part of the street tire group for the first time, he wouldn't say what street tire was fastest, but I have a feeling that it was the RS-3's.

I really like the Dunlop Star Spec Direzza's and Advan AD08's, but will give the Hankook RS-3's a shot next.

 

[Coz]

For serious track/street use without going total racing tires.

Yokohama: AD-08, Expensive
Nitto NT-01's: Not as expensive as AD-08's

Street & decent track use and a great deal for the money.
Nitto: NT-05's.

 

[Scin]

For serious track/street use without going total racing tires.

Yokohama: AD-08, Expensive
Nitto NT-01's: Not as expensive as AD-08's

Street & decent track use and a great deal for the money.
Nitto: NT-05's.

Agreed on NT01's as the best overall value if you aren't limited to running just street tires. Great grip, wear and price--for track days buy these

 

[kjcemo]

XS's or RE-11's or Star's or AD08's or R888 or NT-01's or RS-3's?????????

My conclusion is to go with the XS's. If the available sizes for these other tires was more suitable to my needs it would have been a much more grueling decision making task. Most of them were only available in 225/50x16. I do not think using this different size would be an advantage over the available 215/45x16 in the XS's.

I commend you forum members for your input. I will post a comment with the results of my tire testing after April 30.

NEWS BREAK
No Availability for XS's in 215/45x16's at this time...........................

 

[9doors]

NEWS BREAK
No Availability for XS's in 215/45x16's at this time...........................

Did you check here?

Also, since it seems you are running the pre-2002 OEM wheels, the only pure track tires I've found that would fit the size are these.

I could be wrong, but the Nitto's won't fit the pre-2002 OEM setup.

 

[Black 94 #400]

Hey I had the same problem with my 94, so I went from the Falken Azenis RT-615's to the Nitto Inov their treat wear is little higher, but it still sticks well in the corners, once their broken in, or put miles on them. I’m happy with them. Check out their site http://www.nittotire.com/

 

[kjcemo]

The Kumho Ecsta XS is NOT AVAILABLE from Kumho in a 215/45x16 at this time!

I have called numerous tire suppliers, warehouses and checked on Ebay/Amazon for any currently available stock. No one has this size.

I have ordered up a set of the latest generation of Falken Azenis the RT-615K. As for how much an improvement these are over the former model and how they compare to a Kumho Ecsta XS is a crap shoot. The only tire comparison test for these is by Tyler McQuarrie who says "you will be blown away with the performance of the RT 615K (over the RT 615)! Check out the link below (I don't know how to do a "check here" so you get the whole URL).

http://www.wreckedmagazine.com/blog...re-test-falken-azenis-rt615-vs-“new”-rt-615k/

Now keep in mind as you read this that he is part of Falken's Drift Team and has never been photographed without his Falken cap on.

So for the price of $640 (including shipping) from Discount Tire Direct (where I bought the last set) or VulcanTire.com for $634 (minus the $80 rebate I hope to receive thanks to a mention of this in a thread by nsxtasy) I will be conducting my own tire test!

 

[nsxtasy]

Seize the moment. Can anyone tell me what discussion I should be looking at for my specific application? I need to replace my Falken Azenis RT-615's with a stickier rubber. Great tires for the money but I am lusting for a little faster lap times and still be able to use them for limited mileage on the street. Tires need to fit 16x7 and 17x8 wheels.

Has this topic been covered recently? Please let me know.

Yes, it has been covered quite a bit, notably here and here.

Here are the best options in supersticky "extreme performance" street tires in 16"/17" sizes:

Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 205/45-16 and (245/40-17 or 255/40-17)
Kumho Ecsta XS 215/45-16 and (245/40-17 or 255/40-17)
Toyo Proxes R1R 205/45-16 and (245/40-17 or 255/40-17)
Falken Azenis RT-615K 215/45-16 and 255/40-17

As you have already noted, the Kumho XS is currently out of stock at the Tire Rack in 215/45-16.

There are NO R compound track tires available in 16" sizes to fit the NSX front.

You might also want to explore the possibility of r-compound tires, like the R888's or A048's which come in 16/17 friendly sizes.

Neither one of those comes in 16" sizes that work well on the NSX. The 195/50-16 is too narrow (especially with wide rears) and the 225/45-16 will rub.

I am still curious about the Spec's, AD08's and the RE-11's on the NSX. Tire Racks testing puts all 4 in the same ballpark in the dry tests. However I would have to go with 225/50x16's on the front.

That's much too big in front. But the RE-11 is available in 205/45-16, which will work fine.

You may want to check out the Hankook RS-3's.

They're not available in any 16" size that fits the NSX front.

For serious track/street use without going total racing tires.

Yokohama: AD-08, Expensive
Nitto NT-01's: Not as expensive as AD-08's

Street & decent track use and a great deal for the money.
Nitto: NT-05's.

The NT-01 is an R compound track tire; the only 16" size is 245/50-16, which is MUCH too big for the NSX front. The NT-05 doesn't come in any 16" size at all. And the AD08 doesn't come in any 16" size for the NSX front. (Are you just shouting out whatever tire make/model comes to mind, without taking into account the sizes available? )

Agreed on NT01's as the best overall value if you aren't limited to running just street tires. Great grip, wear and price--for track days buy these

Again, there's no 16" front size for the NSX.

 

[W]

Neither one of those comes in 16" sizes that work well on the NSX. The 195/50-16 is too narrow (especially with wide rears) and the 225/45-16 will rub.

I don't agree with your assessment of the 225/45/16 A048.

Let's compare the 225/45/16 A048 to one of the common 215/40/17 performance tires such as the Z1 Star Spec.

From Tire Rack's website:
A048 - 23.8" tall, 8.9" section width (7.5" measuring rim)
Z1 - 23.8" tall, 8.7 section width (7.5" measuring rim)

Now let's compare the A048 with a 7" wheel as the Op stated he would use versus the Z1 on an 8" wheel that many on this board use and seem to think works well on the NSX:
A048 - 23.8" tall, 8.7" section width (7" measuring rim)
Z1 - 23.8" tall, 8.9 section width (8" measuring rim)

It would seem by the above that the A048 would work quite well. Maybe you're confused about the sizing of a 225/45/16 on a 7" rim and thinking it's more like the commonly tracked 235/40/17's on wide wheels.

 

[docjohn]

I use to use 225/45/16 p zero-c in my early track years,they work,but rub just like my current 235/40/17,but that is acceptable to me.

 

[W]

I use to use 225/45/16 p zero-c in my early track years,they work,but rub just like my current 235/40/17,but that is acceptable to me.

I'm wondering about width and offset and where it rubbed. I ran a 225/50/15 setup that was wider than the 225/45/16 and only .1" shorter and I don't recall it rubbing but I was probably on much stiffer springs than the OP. I don't have that setup anymore so I can't put it on and drive around the streets to see it's characteristics.

 

[CL65 Captain]

There are NO R compound track tires available in 16" sizes to fit the NSX front.

Again, there's no 16" front size for the NSX.

Ken - Kumho Ecsta V710 comes in a 215/45/16 & 245/40/17

 

[nsxtasy]

I don't agree with your assessment of the 225/45/16 A048.

They rub.

Rubbing is caused by reduced clearance, which results not only from an increase in diameter, but also from an increase in width. 225/45-16 is not only slightly larger in diameter than the stock front sizes, but it is also wider. As docjohn notes, they rub.

Ken - Kumho Ecsta V710 comes in a 215/45/16 & 245/40/17

Thanks for the correction. (They're not street tires, though, the original subject of this topic.)

 

[W]

They rub.

Rubbing is caused by reduced clearance, which results not only from an increase in diameter, but also from an increase in width. 225/45-16 is not only slightly larger in diameter than the stock front sizes, but it is also wider. As docjohn notes, they rub.

How about this as a statement? The 225/45/16 may or may not rub depending on actual tire measurements, wheel widths, offsets, steering angle, springs rates, swaybars and other factors. Some may say this does not work well and some may say this does work well.

 

[docjohn]

And to be fair and balanced:wink:...at the time my susp was HR springs koni yellows with stock blades wheels.Rubbed fender liner on top and inner wall on full lock.

 

[nsxtasy]

There is a serious chance that you will be stuck with tires that rub if you buy 225/45-16. There is little to no such risk if you buy front tires in 205/45-16 or 215/45-16 instead.

W, since you are so intent on telling people to get tires that have a good chance of rubbing while discounting this possibility, I think it would be only fair for you to provide a refund to anyone who buys such tires on your recommendation only to discover that they rub. That would be the right thing to do when you are creating a serious risk of dissatisfaction with expenditures that others make. Are you willing to make that commitment here, or don't you believe in your own advice? Which is it?

 

[W]

There is a serious chance that you will be stuck with tires that rub if you buy 225/45-16. There is little to no such risk if you buy front tires in 205/45-16 or 215/45-16 instead.

W, since you are so intent on telling people to get tires that have a good chance of rubbing while discounting this possibility, I think it would be only fair for you to provide a refund to anyone who buys such tires on your recommendation only to discover that they rub. That would be the right thing to do when you are creating a serious risk of dissatisfaction with expenditures that others make. Are you willing to make that commitment here, or don't you believe in your own advice? Which is it?

Maybe I'm not quite reading your response right but it seems a little aggressive and that I've gotten you a little ticked. If so, it's not my intention and I apologize. Let's be friends on this board.

It's not like any of us are collecting fees for our advice and opinions. We're just a bunch of car guys/gals putting our heads together and coming up with ideas and potential solutions.

OK, how about this wording?
The 225/45/16 will rub. Other factors, such as actual tire measurements, wheel widths, offsets, steering angle, springs rates, swaybars,... may affect the degree to which it rubs and where and in what situations,...

You know what's funny? I mainly didn't like how you were equating 'doesn't work well on the NSX' with rubbing. I should have just stated that and moved on.

 

[W]

And to be fair and balanced:wink:...at the time my susp was HR springs koni yellows with stock blades wheels.Rubbed fender liner on top and inner wall on full lock.

Thanks!

 

[nsxtasy]

Maybe I'm not quite reading your response right but it seems a little aggressive and that I've gotten you a little ticked. If so, it's not my intention and I apologize. Let's be friends on this board.

Fair enough. I just wouldn't want someone to buy that size without realizing that there's a good chance of rubbing, and then be upset with the results.

Oh, and there's another potential problem. 225/45-16 may cause problems with the TCS on a '91-93 NSX, when used with a rear size of 245/40-17 or 255/40-17 (likely with the 245/40, possible with the 255/40 as the rears wear down more than the fronts).

Of course, if these track tires are only going to be used on the track with the TCS off, rubbing at full lock or TCS issues may not be cause for concern. But they're worth noting.

 

[W]

Fair enough. I just wouldn't want someone to buy that size without realizing that there's a good chance of rubbing, and then be upset with the results.

Agreed.