Front camber vs tire wear

thouchin

thouchin

Contributing Member
Joined
12 October 2003
Messages
142
Location
Pittsburgh, PA
1) I looking to reduce understeer at the track
2) I'm tired of the front tires having longer life than the rears on the street.

So I'm going with more camber in the front tires.

The question is, does anyone have experience with how much camber I can get away with before the front tire wears out before the rears?

T.J.
 
it's a rear wheel drive, mid engine car, there's nothing you could do to make it wear faster than the rear. Potentially, you could dial in more front camber and less rear, zero toe in rear. But I'm not sure if you will like that setup.

Without any modification to the supension, just max out the camber if you want better wear on track.
 
No, I definately dont want to reduce the rear traction.

I will just dial in as much camber as I can. The car is lowered by 3/4" so I should be able to get a little more than at stock ride hieght.

Thanks for the reply

T.J.
 
Understeer isn't a problem with the NSX. It can turn into oversteer at the blink of an eye. The good news about mid-engine cars is, they like to turn. The bad news is, they like to keep turning. :smile:

On the NSX, front tires will always last longer than the rears. The best way to deal with this is to replace the rear tires more often. :smile:

I've found that, with track use, the outer edges of the front tires on my NSX are wearing faster than the rest of the tread. So I had the car aligned so that it is still within the spec, but at the most negative end of the recommended range.
 
nsxtasy said:
Understeer isn't a problem with the NSX.
Click to expand...

My experience with production cars is that understeer is always a problem. The manufactures always lean toward understeer because its inherently stable. However, I do agree that the stock NSX is more nuetral than other cars.

Couple questions... why would you have the fronts set only to max camber within range of Honda's spec? I suspect that you are still wearing the outside of your race tires, why not go all the way? Is there a down side to more camber other than wearing out the inside of your street tires?

T.J.
 
thouchin said:
My experience with production cars is that understeer is always a problem. The manufactures always lean toward understeer because its inherently stable. However, I do agree that the stock NSX is more nuetral than other cars.

Couple questions... why would you have the fronts set only to max camber within range of Honda's spec? I suspect that you are still wearing the outside of your race tires, why not go all the way? Is there a down side to more camber other than wearing out the inside of your street tires?

T.J.
Click to expand...
Because he is nsxtasy, and dosn't stray too far from the norm...
 
I have found street tires continue to build cornering traction up to -2 degrees of camber on the front. If this is paired with .1 degree of total toe out, it yields good cornering traction, acceptable turn in and tire wear and great threshold brake stability if you run compliance clamps.
 
thouchin said:
why would you have the fronts set only to max camber within range of Honda's spec?
Click to expand...
Because they weren't set that far.

thouchin said:
I suspect that you are still wearing the outside of your race tires, why not go all the way?
Click to expand...
Actually, with the new setting, it hasn't been wearing the outside edge a whole lot.

thouchin said:
Is there a down side to more camber other than wearing out the inside of your street tires?
Click to expand...
Well, that's certainly the most obvious one.

Of course, alignment settings can be changed at any time; you try one out, and if you don't like it, you can always change it. So far, I like where mine is set.

stuntman said:
Because he is nsxtasy, and dosn't stray too far from the norm...
Click to expand...
Great, advice from the guy whose own personal standards include plastering the side of his NSX with an ad from a strip club. :rolleyes:
 
nsxtasy said:
Great, advice from the guy whose own personal standards include plastering the side of his NSX with an ad from a strip club. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Ken, everyone has their own norm...
 
nsxtasy said:
Great, advice from the guy whose own personal standards include plastering the side of his NSX with an ad from a strip club. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Have you seen the unlimited car? (fyi-I don't own it, just hired to drive it :biggrin: )
DSC_0804cropped.jpg

You may not be familiar with sponsors, but they make racing possible -funding the effort. At this level, logos on the car are from sponsors who fund/aid in the racing effort -not just products that you use/enjoy (which the vast majority of club racers do).

Advice from a multi-time attack champion, or from a forum king/weekend worrior/HPDE 'expert' -everyone's free to make their choice on which advice to follow...

KooLaid said:
Especially if it pays the bills.

Which brings up my latest question, is Seamless not sponsoring the Unlimited car?
Click to expand...
I believe it's still under negotiation... Don't see why they won't want to come back with all the coverage/wins/and publicity they will get. Also other sponsors are in the works...:biggrin:
 
stuntman said:
Advice from a multi-time attack champion, or from a forum king/weekend worrior/HPDE 'expert' -everyone's free to make their choice on which advice to follow...
Click to expand...

Ok, well I don't know about the rest of you but I'll be hitting some strip clubs this weekend! :smile:

I wasn't sure where these FX750's were coming from, but hey... now that the cat is out of the bag so to speak let's just hope that the ATM at "The Foxy Lady" doesn't run out of $20's before I get a signed sponsorship agreement.

Maybe Ken is 'above' stripper sponsors but shit, I'm not. I'll paint mine pink with huge anime boob graphics across the rear wing for a couple of those 750rwhp engines. LOL. :biggrin:
 
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John@Microsoft said:
Maybe Ken is 'above' stripper sponsors but shit, I'm not. I'll paint mine pink with huge anime boob graphics across the rear wing for a couple of those 750rwhp engines. LOL. :biggrin:
Click to expand...

Nice save John:wink: ,thank god for the edit! That's why I don't PWI(Posting While Intoxicated)! Friends shouldn't let friends post drunk!

Talk about norms...
 
titaniumdave said:
Nice save John:wink: ,thank god for the edit! That's why I don't PWI(Posting While Intoxicated)! Friends shouldn't let friends post drunk!

Talk about norms...
Click to expand...

Ok, I digress maybe some minimal standards for sponsors may be appropriate so we can avoid lynchings at grid. No driver wants to have to dodge bullets from the grand stands. Still, this is hardly the first time even pro teams have been flaught with controversy over their sponsors. I think Strip clubs and adult entertainment shops should be ok, I say no harm no foul. :tongue:

Dave, look you want to win that enduro or not? Sometimes winning means you have to do things you aren't particularly proud of. :wink:

I think the FX guys are on to something... and that color schema is starting to grow on me now... hey, if pink is good enough for Earhnhardt and Legge it's good enough for me.... Just instead of helping to find the cure we'll be helping people to find a little tail... on a less sexy Miata or NSX or something. :biggrin:

FC_WIP_ArticleDetail_insert.gif
 
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nsxtasy said:
Great, advice from the guy whose own personal standards include plastering the side of his NSX with an ad from a strip club. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...



Sorry for being male shovanistic heterosexuals that are blatantly expressing our admiration for the female form. Btw, they are a gentlemen’s club, and we are only doing our part in helping those poor girls through college and helping them take care of their sick parents. At least that’s what they have been telling us:confused:
 
KooLaid said:
Especially if it pays the bills.

Which brings up my latest question, is Seamless not sponsoring the Unlimited car?
Click to expand...

We shall see what happens...
 
stuntman said:
DSC_0804cropped.jpg


Advice from a multi-time attack champion, or from a forum king/weekend worrior/HPDE 'expert' -everyone's free to make their choice on which advice to follow...

QUOTE]


Don't sell yourself short. The Multi Time Attack Championships pale in comparison to your other accomplishments. Here is last years profile for Billy. (We need to add 2 more Time Attack Championships and 4 1st place finishes this past year in Grandam.)

Billy Johnson made his racing debut in 2000 at the age of 13 racing go-karts. The Californian has won multiple championships at the local, regional, and national level. In 2003 Billy moved up into auto racing after winning the Skip Barber Racing School scholarship. The next day he flew to Valencia, Spain and won another scholarship from BMW AG for the inaugural season of the Formula BMW USA series. In the 2004 F-BMW season, Billy finished 5th in the championship as well as receiving the Sportsman of the Year Award

Over the last four years, Billy has raced in the Grand Am Rolex, Grand Am Cup, Speed World Challenge, Formula Star Mazda Pro, Formula BMW, Skip Barber regional and national series, Super Street Time Attack, and Redline Time Attack. In those series Billy has finished in the top ten 38 times, with 9 wins, and 21 top five finishes. Billy is also the youngest instructor to be hired at the prestigious Skip Barber Racing School.

At 20 years of age, Billy stays busy working to further his career as a professional race car driver and attends college full time. Billy also works as a test driver for auto-mobile and tire manufacturers, as a driver for manufacturer demonstration days, and an instructor/advisor to Ferrari Club of Southern California.
Click to expand...
 
No shit? You're a skip barber instructor? that's pretty cool

If Seamless does decide to pick up sponsorship on the unlimited car, I hope it stays flat black. I like that color, seamless's logo seems bland in comparison to the car though!
 
Factor X Motorsports said:
Billy Johnson made his racing debut in 2000 at the age of 13 racing go-karts. The Californian has won multiple championships at the local, regional, and national level. In 2003 Billy moved up into auto racing after winning the Skip Barber Racing School scholarship. The next day he flew to Valencia, Spain and won another scholarship from BMW AG for the inaugural season of the Formula BMW USA series. In the 2004 F-BMW season, Billy finished 5th in the championship as well as receiving the Sportsman of the Year Award

Over the last four years, Billy has raced in the Grand Am Rolex, Grand Am Cup, Speed World Challenge, Formula Star Mazda Pro, Formula BMW, Skip Barber regional and national series, Super Street Time Attack, and Redline Time Attack. In those series Billy has finished in the top ten 38 times, with 9 wins, and 21 top five finishes. Billy is also the youngest instructor to be hired at the prestigious Skip Barber Racing School.

At 20 years of age, Billy stays busy working to further his career as a professional race car driver and attends college full time. Billy also works as a test driver for auto-mobile and tire manufacturers, as a driver for manufacturer demonstration days, and an instructor/advisor to Ferrari Club of Southern California.
Click to expand...

Yeah, yeah, yeah... but look.... maybe you guys aren't seeing the big picture here. :smile: :biggrin:

12,000 HPDE miles and 22,000 posts... club president...

The other thing... Billy does have two infractions.. :wink:

Uggh.... (shakes head) look... I'm sure in time you guys can all learn to play king of the hill without the nose bleeds. It's easy to butt heads-online with things out of context. Me and Ken have done it plenty of times over the years. Everyone here wants to help members out and just pre-fixing the posts with "in my experience which consists of..." and bam done.
 
Last edited:
Front camber vs tire wear...

I forgot what this thread was all about...? Anyone?
 

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