Drivers Ed and Insurance

[druby]

Hey Folks:

I hope someone knows the answer to this for sure. I went to my first drivers ed in November and I have another next weekend. (May 1 & 2). The folks that put on the DE say that since the event is drivers education that my insurance will cover me if any damage occurs to my car while on the track. Does anyone know if that is true? If it is not true where do you get coverage for while you are on the track? Roebling is a pretty safe track but better safe than sorry. I didn't want to call my insurance guy and give a heart problems by asking the question but that's what I may have to do.

 

[DocL]

The only way to find out for sure is to ask your insurance company.

 

[druby]

Thanks I guess I'll have to call my broker to make sure.

 

[gobble]

Read your policy.

My Liberty Mutual policy denies coverage for "Any vehicle, located inside a facility designed for racing, for the purpose of : a. competing in; or b. practicing or preparing for; any prearranged or organized racing or speed contest."

 

[Larry Bastanza]

gobble, you are not doing any of those things. You are taking a High Performance Driving School.

I have seem companies cover it ONCE, you will not get away with it twice.

JMO,
LarryB

 

[gobble]

gobble, you are not doing any of those things. You are taking a High Performance Driving School.

I have seem companies cover it ONCE, you will not get away with it twice.

JMO,
LarryB

I agree. I should have said that in my post.

I'm not racing and its not a timed or speed contest. I'm sure the DE organizers structure their events very carefully in order to comply with most insurance policies.

 

[nsxtasy]

Most insurance policies have a clause about "competition and timed events", which an HPDE is not. However, recently some insurance companies have issued policies prohibiting coverage on racetracks without any reference to the type of event. Check with your insurance company.

 

[wildbill846]

USAA dropped my collision and comprehensive for my NSX, my motorcycle, and my F-150 merely because I asked about such events. Ends up being, USAA's policy....at least under the underwriters for North Carolina, exclude coverage for any event sponsored by a sports car club or organization regardless if it is timed, or competitive. In fact, it seems to be worded to exclude coverage at car shows...

While I understand the company not wanting to cover vehicles on track, I questioned why this would mean I would not be covered if my truck was stolen out of my own garage. In the time that it took me to convince USAA how ridiculous this was, I was also able to find a lower rate elsewhere.....so in the end...good for me.


Bill

 

[RSO 34]

Check the exclusions contained within your policy. I would also caution you about checking with your broker because the first response may be that it is not covered because that is what they all presume. When they then follow-up with the underwriter you may find that they will cancel your coverage because you are taking the car on the track.

More and more carriers are including exclusionary language covering ANY track event whether HPDE or time events. It depends upon the policy language in the first instance and then if not specifically excluded, they will most likely fight any attempts to collect if there is an incident. At that point, if there is no express exclusion you should be able to get reimbursement for one incident but expect to be dropped immediately thereafter.

Currently, my firm is representing a carrier on a claim filed by a Porsche club member for an HPDE incident at Lime Rock. They are disclaiming because he submitted photos of the car with the numbers still on it, his helmet on the seat and the 5 point restraints clearly visible in the photo.

 

[druby]

OK, everyone I called my broker and he stated that yes I will be covered during the DE, yee ha!

 

[MarkB]

OK, everyone I called my broker and he stated that yes I will be covered during the DE, yee ha!

I suggest thet you read your policy anyway. It can't hurt to be sure.

 

[RP-Motorsports]

Currently, my firm is representing a carrier on a claim filed by a Porsche club member for an HPDE incident at Lime Rock. They are disclaiming because he submitted photos of the car with the numbers still on it, his helmet on the seat and the 5 point restraints clearly visible in the photo.

I got a passing violation ticket once due to the cop testifying that my car had "racing pariphenalia" (seat, 5 pt., shift knob, wing, pedals, etc) The judge didn't listen to my proof that I was innocent. What a joke.

Also it is the insurance companies BS rates/rules that promotes people do be fraudulant in ways so they will get covered in full.

I had a friend do a touring session (non-timed, 70mph speed limit etc) and took a turn too fast, and went into the grass and hit some cement. This session is safer than public roads. He could have lied and said it did happen on the road, but since he knew that American Family has covered driving school crashes, he thought for sure he would be covered, so he told them the truth. They said that he couldn't prove that he wasn't racing, and since it happened at a track, they denied his claim. He was out between 10 and 15 grand. Now if he ever does a touring session or HPDE event ever again and has an accident do you think he will ever tell the truth?

 

[nsxtasy]

At a track event this past weekend, a policy covering HPDE events was mentioned. It's provided by American Collectors Insurance. My understanding is that they charge 1.5 percent of your car's value, and it covers the car's value for a year, for as many driver's ed track events as you wish to participate in. There is a 20 PERCENT deductible. This policy is designed to cover most of the value of the car in the event of damage at driver's ed events, and I don't think it covers your liability beyond the value of your own car.

 

[NeSX]

I spoke with American Collectors last week and it seems like a pretty good deal. I am getting some pictures of my car printed to provide with the application.

The really nice thing is that it is an 'agreed upon value' so you know exactly what your payout would be in an accident.

 

[nsxtasy]

This was just posted on the NSX e-mail list:

-----Original Message-----
From: Robert B. Peirce
Sent: Monday, May 17, 2004 10:01 AM
To: Nsx Mailing List
Subject: [nsx-list] DE Insurance

Thanks to Eric Robbins, I was able to insure both my NSX and my MB 450SEL 6.9 for track usage for a rather expensive $1127.50 for 10 events. This is with a 15% deductible, or $8,250. It ain’t cheap, but at least I know I am covered. The company is Laurel DE, a Canadian Company representing Pacific Insurance Company, http://www.laurelde.com.

The important thing here is KNOWING you are covered. I wasn’t willing to take a chance that my auto insurance MIGHT cover me at least once, as has been suggested by others.

It is important to note that this insurance was developed for PCA DEs. In the last month or so, it has been broadened to cover any DE event with run groups having roughly similar abilities, no racing and no timing. I have asked for a specific endorsement to that effect. BTW, Eric pointed out they also can cover racing cars, if that is what you need.

If your insurance company, like mine, is now excluding ANY event that takes place on a closed track, including in some cases, even being in the parking lot(!), then something like this may be worth a look.

Or, you can take a chance that your insurance company might cover you.

 

[1BADNSX]

At a track event this past weekend, a policy covering HPDE events was mentioned. It's provided by American Collectors Insurance. My understanding is that they charge 1.5 percent of your car's value, and it covers the car's value for a year, for as many driver's ed track events as you wish to participate in. There is a 20 PERCENT deductible. This policy is designed to cover most of the value of the car in the event of damage at driver's ed events, and I don't think it covers your liability beyond the value of your own car.

Ken, the problem with this coverage is it doesn't cover liability at all and this could be your biggest concern. BMWCCA covers liability for instructors, but I am not sure about other groups. I have considered not giving rides anymore for this very reason.

Bob

 

[ncdogdoc]

Any of the lawyers here know if my umbrella liability policy would cover personal injury for this sort of thing. I have put off applying for instructor status, even at the greater expense, due to this among other reasons.

 

[RSO 34]

It depends on the policy language but generally an umbrella policy affords no greater protection, other than monetarily, than your primary coverage. The biggest exception involves defamation claims which usually are excluded from primary coverage but are included on the umbrella policy.

Excess policies usually will not kick in unless the primary coverage is exhausted and will not be available unless your main policy covers the loss in the first instance.