Do you guys track your cars without a dry sump?

SugrueNSX · 7 March 2005

I’m thinking about using an NSX for DE days at our local track (Seattle international raceway).
My question is has anyone experienced oil starvation when tracking an NSX. Or does it depend on the track and what tires are being used. What do people think about the Acusump system with a baffled pan or do you recommend a full dry sump. Or does stock work ok?

Regards,

Patrick

Briank · 7 March 2005

Stock works fine for a stock car. Add a super charger, headers, R compound tires, big brakes, lots of driving skill and then maybe an accusump would be something to think about getting. :biggrin:

mystican · 7 March 2005

I have talked to some NSX experts and have been told to be very careful with making sure that the oil level in the NSX enigne is "topped off"...

I believe it is cylinder # 6 is the one that gets "starved"...

I would recommend a baffled oil pan...

polar · 7 March 2005

Hi Patrick
Me along with a few friends track our cars at least 3-4 times a year at SiR. My car is mostly stock and others have some minor mods like header exhaust and suspension. We never had any problem with our cars. I believe when you put up more mods to the car and as your skill progress, you might want to think about putting a drysump in the car.
Hopefully to see you at the track or Local meeting.

NSX-Racer · 7 March 2005

Track the 3.2 l car for nearly 7 years now (most of the time with race slicks which means a lot of g forces) without dry sump and had no oil supply problem at all. The only engine issue was a bad head gasket last year (has nothing to do with the oil I guess) - other parts seem to be just fine and I really do not baby the car.

edit: typo, added engine type

Ponyboy · 7 March 2005

Don't think you need to go "dry-sump." A baffled pan and an oil pump gear should be enough for the vast majority of DE drivers. An Accusump couldn't hurt though and they're really not that expensive.

Andrie Hartanto · 7 March 2005

If you have 3.0 motor, I would seriously consider accusump if you are:
1. Fast enough
2. run slicks. I mean full racing slicks not just R compound.

We toasted our motor at NSXPO 2003 at Sears Point from oil starvation. Burnt the rod bearing.

mikeh · 7 March 2005

Andrie Hartanto said:
If you have 3.0 motor, I would seriously consider accusump if you are:
1. Fast enough
2. run slicks. I mean full racing slicks not just R compound.

We toasted our motor at NSXPO 2003 at Sears Point from oil starvation. Burnt the rod bearing.

Hey Andrie,

How many miles were on the engine, and did it have the original rod bearings?

I'm just curious because this car sees tons of track time + this years OTC (and it's my daily driver) and this is the only area of the car where I'm shooting in the dark. I need to research the accusump solution more..

-mike

VBNSX · 7 March 2005

Great.. here's another money pit... but it's good insurance..

anywho.

Here's what i gather:

http://www.accusump.com/

You can use a sandwhich adapter:
http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/adapters/accusump_input.html

then you'll need the main unit:
http://www.accusump.com/acc_products/acc_units.html

probably want a gauge to see what's up:
http://www.accusump.com/acc_products/acc_gauge.htm

then a valve:
http://www.accusump.com/acc_products/acc_valves.html

and mouting clamps:
http://www.accusump.com/acc_products/acc_clamps.html

then of course the general lines and stuff...

My only problem is the first part.. The sandwich adapter adds 1.25" to the length of the filter. I don't think we have that much room to spare... I was thinking maybe to T off the oil pressure switch????

any opinions would be appreciated.

x

Ponyboy · 7 March 2005

You may want to ping Mark and see what the latest is with his Accusump kit.

And perhaps with the sandwich adaptor, you can use the 91-95 Legend filter?

Andrie Hartanto · 7 March 2005

mikeh said:
Hey Andrie,

How many miles were on the engine, and did it have the original rod bearings?

I'm just curious because this car sees tons of track time + this years OTC (and it's my daily driver) and this is the only area of the car where I'm shooting in the dark. I need to research the accusump solution more..

-mike

Mike,

the car is a 96 with 36K miles on the clock. Not too many track miles, more of them are street miles. Keep in mind we only see this failures on 3.0L motor and running full slicks. To me, the accusump is a cheap insurance. Ping me if you like some pointers on how to install them correctly and all the parts you need. Also, if you like to buy from us, we can arrange a discounts for NSXprime member.

Andrie Hartanto · 7 March 2005

To answer about the sandwich adapter, you can relocate your handbrake cable and allow it to fit stock filter. Otherwise you will have to run shorter legend filter. I ran the legend filter and had no problem.

For 95 and up cars you don't need to do anything. There is enough clearance. Honda put built in spacers to the bottom brace for cat clearance and it work great.

Peter Mills · 7 March 2005

Andrie Hartanto said:
If you have 3.0 motor, I would seriously consider accusump if you are:
1. Fast enough
2. run slicks. I mean full racing slicks not just R compound.

We toasted our motor at NSXPO 2003 at Sears Point from oil starvation. Burnt the rod bearing.

Andrie:
You weren't that fast. it must have been Tom or you forgot to check the oil level.

Andrie Hartanto · 7 March 2005

Peter,

you better do lots of practicing for Phoenix. Don't want to get embarrased again

VBNSX · 7 March 2005

one of these days i'm gonna get good enough to talk smack..

On another note... does anyone out there have any pics of any previous installs on these sumps?

Kinda curious where others have mounted the tank.

x

SugrueNSX · 8 March 2005

Thanks for the answers guys. Very informative! Does anyone know at what pressure the stock low oil pressure switch kicks in at. And is there a competition version that closes at a higher pressure like maybe 25 psi or something?

Andrie Hartanto · 8 March 2005

SugrueNSX said:
Thanks for the answers guys. Very informative! Does anyone know at what pressure the stock low oil pressure switch kicks in at. And is there a competition version that closes at a higher pressure like maybe 25 psi or something?

About 5psi.

Autometer make an adjustable one. You can adjust it up to 30 psi IIRC.

KGP · 9 March 2005

VBNSX said:
...does anyone out there have any pics of any previous installs on these sumps?

Kinda curious where others have mounted the tank.

Of the installs I have seen, they have been mounted in the trunk. Those have been the 3qt models (I will try to remember where I have seen pics). You can also get a 1qt or 2qt model. The 1qt model should fit in the engine bay, and I'm fairly certain the 2qt would also. I debated for weeks over installing one of these, and opted not to, at least not at the moment. I have no real idea how much it might help, but in addition to my oil pan being baffled, I had the inside of it coated, as well as the insides of the valve covers, all in an effort to return the oil as fast as possible to the pan.

KGP · 9 March 2005

Pic

From the DAL car...

Andrie Hartanto · 9 March 2005

Re: Pic

The NSX will require 3 Qt system. Anything less is insufficent. You don't need the high pressure system. I mount mine inside the right rear fender. It is a tight fit, but it does fit nicely there.

KGP · 9 March 2005

Re: Pic

Andrie Hartanto said:
The NSX will require 3 Qt system. Anything less is insufficent.

Andrie, why? I mean why would a 1qt not be better than not having one at all?

Andrie Hartanto · 9 March 2005

Re: Pic

KGP said:
Andrie, why? I mean why would a 1qt not be better than not having one at all?

As you can also see on their website, accusump market their 1 qt unit as a simple pre-oiling syste, Not as a loss pressure protection. We usually go by engine size. Anything less than 3Qt unit will not be sufficient protection for loss pressure. It is relatively big engine after all.

Ponyboy · 9 March 2005

Andrie, I've looked on your website but see nothing pertaining to an Accusump sans an article describing the race kaa. Can you provide pricing info and pics?

PM is fine if preferred. Gracias.

KGP · 9 March 2005

Andrie, I hear ya. Actually, I didn't consider the 1 qt., but did consider the 2qt. Perhaps I shouldn't have even mentioned the 1 qt model. :redface: From the accusump website: "[2 qt]Ideal for applications where mounting space is restricted. Our 2 qt. systems are recommended for surge control on Small Block V-8, V-6, and 4 cylinder engines." I'm not arguing the point, just was trying to figure out where the line is. If it is only 3 qt, so be it. Just tossing out the possibility of the 2qt model.

mikeh · 15 March 2005

Andrie Hartanto said:
Mike,

the car is a 96 with 36K miles on the clock. Not too many track miles, more of them are street miles. Keep in mind we only see this failures on 3.0L motor and running full slicks. To me, the accusump is a cheap insurance. Ping me if you like some pointers on how to install them correctly and all the parts you need. Also, if you like to buy from us, we can arrange a discounts for NSXprime member.

Ever since my blower install, my oil pressure has been scaring me... I know the stock sender/gauge is notoriously inconsistent. I'm seeing very low pressure, rite at the 0 line, but not below as when the engine is turned off, and around the first mark on the gauge.. other times when on the freeway cruising or when cruising in traffic it will be at the normal 4-5 mark. Because it's making me this nervous on the street, I'm very reluctant to take it to the track without any additional oil system modifications.

I probably should just install a external oil pressure and temp gauge and start monitoring it now, before making any changes.

I've spent today researching an accusump solution w/ external oil cooler, and think I'm on the rite track. Andrie, if you could send me a list of the parts you know I would need, and wether you could supply them or not that would be excellent (you can exclude the AN lines if you want, I was planning to build my own).

Also, has anyone researched the OEM oil pump and if it can flow enough to properly take advantage of the increased oil volume of an accusump + oil cooler + additional couple feet of -10 AN line? The oil pump appears to be in a difficult position for the home DIY'er to quickly remove/inspect/measure/replace.... I think mine is the original, and it's going on 15 years and over 100k miles......

Cheers,

-mike
5 months till the OTC and raceflias is already kicking my ass....

Do you guys track your cars without a dry sump?

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