Anyhope the HSC might be revived??

[WingZ]

Go ahead and yell at me if you want but as a Halo car in these dark times it would certainly work better than another SUV. Cost could be reduced by using the new 3.7 and they could do two versions one with SHAWD and one RWD. Also cost sharing with the RL and new TL for interior parts and use of CF could be done sparingly.

Honda could easily beat the V8 R8 with the 3.7 and could certainly make it have much better fuel economy than a V10.

Seriously do you guys think this needs a lot of updating?

 

[DocL]

McFly. McFly. There isn't going to be another NSX. The car is dead.

 

[WingZ]

McFly. McFly. There isn't going to be another NSX. The car is dead.

But Biff I didn't say NSX I said HSC

 

[DocL]

But Biff I didn't say NSX I said HSC

Doh!!! But we all know that the HSC was intended to replace the NSX. :biggrin:

 

[NSXrunner]

Buttheads.
- Biff

:wink::tongue::biggrin:

 

[kyky-11]

Faith is the substance of things HOPED for. PLEASE HONDA, we are hoping for Mid-Engine.

 

[WingZ]

Faith is the substance of things HOPED for. PLEASE HONDA, we are hoping for Mid-Engine.

The evidence of sportscars unseen:biggrin:

 

[NetViper]

Honda needs to do something to bring some excitement back to the ACURA brand. They new designs are awful.

What they should do is introduce a limited run of the HSC, say 100 units, with the V10. That should do it. It would also make all the NSXers thrilled.

The car is done, the motor is done. (I think) Just need to put them together.

 

[MAJOR STONER]

Why are we so sure that Honda really did intend to replace the sales disaster that is the NSX?

Did they not invent the non-existant NSX-R GT to keep interest in racing a 15 year old car?

Why did they stop the HSC, and replace it with the ASC, a car that made even less sense from a sales perspective?

After it was shown and hated, did the ASC project go forward only to "match" Toyota's efforts?

Two years after the show car, we saw the crude S2000 test mule...Was it a next-gen S2000 test mule?

Why did the S2000 test mule have British plates? And off by a digit, front to back?

Why don't the plates come from the area where the F1 team is located?

Why is KGP the only source of information/spy pictures?

Do you really think that the ASC ring car broke the record on the first time on the track?

How did KGP get a lap time of 7:37, but no photos at/near the start finish line?

How do KGP know to be at the track entrance when the car shows up, and in front of the skunk-werks shop when the car arrives home?

Why are the "spy" photos taken from inside the track, six feet away from the track?

Why are there photos of the car with a "Corvette in testing" just in back, surely manufacturers don't race prototypes around the same track at the same time, back-to-back?

Why discontinue a limited edition "halo"/GT race car that is production ready, and already an unofficial Nurburgring spankmeister?

Why delay V-8 developement until 2015, when GM may go under next month?

Why develope so many prototypes that will never see the "light of day"?

 

[NSXGMS]

Honda needs to do something to bring some excitement back to the ACURA brand. They new designs are awful.

What they should do is introduce a limited run of the HSC, say 100 units, with the V10. That should do it. It would also make all the NSXers thrilled.

The car is done, the motor is done. (I think) Just need to put them together.

I think the HSC idea, if done right in every way, could likely work but you're going to have to have a driving force totally committed to making it work and Fukui is not that force. Soichiro got it done but sadly the spirit of what the NSX embodied died with him. Honda's reputation is being steered back to the time before the NSX when people could never get their head around the fact that Honda could or would have created the NSX. The desire to create such a product is just not in the cards, I'm afraid.

I personally think the V-10 is quite simply a disaster and the V-8 must be the engine. Honda needs at least one anyway and it will be a much more flexible and practical option. A 4.0L, 450+ hp V-8 should be child's play for Honda. The world's best SH-AWD system should also be child's play for Honda.

A great niche would be to develop a fantastic, reliable F1 tranny that actually works well. The reason no one likes F1 trannys is because most suck. Honda could change that and I think a truly great paddle-shift tranny would be embraced by the public.

Take everything that was learned from the NSX project and try to make every area better. Improve the already impressive suspension geometry, create a very nice, luxurious interior (which is easily and fairly inexpensively done), create a better-looking body design than the HSC (again, easy and inexpensive) and make the production limited or commit to marketing and updating the car as a full-production model and you would have:

-A car as fast or faster than the GT-R
-Better looking than the competition
-The most reliable, practical and easy to drive exotic car
-A car priced well under the F430 and Gallardo
-A new halo car and -another- legitimate chance to elevate the Acura brand
-A new engine and tranny and possibly a whole new platform

I think it might work but certainly the chances under the current Honda regime are slim and none. I can tell you that I would certianly buy that car and there is no other new car, exotic or otherwise, that I would consider buying or leaving my current NSX for. I can't be the only one who feels this way. Right now the only options for people who want this type of car are the 911 or AM Vantage (in that price range). They could spend less and get a C6 Vette, GT-R or Viper or spend more and get the F430, LP-560 or DB9. This car would be better than all of them.

 

[NSXrebel]

Go ahead and yell at me if you want but as a Halo car in these dark times it would certainly work better than another SUV. Cost could be reduced by using the new 3.7 and they could do two versions one with SHAWD and one RWD. Also cost sharing with the RL and new TL for interior parts and use of CF could be done sparingly.

Honda could easily beat the V8 R8 with the 3.7 and could certainly make it have much better fuel economy than a V10.

Seriously do you guys think this needs a lot of updating?

Probably not, you wanted the ASCC. You were one of the very few that wanted it in fact. Didn't you say you didn't like the HSC ?

 

[KooLaid]

I think they outta drop the idea and move forward with something similar to a Turbo Busa powered rwd Smart

 

[Black 94 #400]

Hey Honda saying NO to the HSC, is like saying no to the Beatles, “Groups with guitars are on their way out.” Big mistake :tongue:

 

[Silver F16]

While many of us on this forums prefer the HSC, it makes too much sense to bring it back. Doubt it will happen. Honda has promised Gen 2 NSX or NSX replacement 3 times. None of it happened.

 

[MJSpeed]

Why are we so sure that Honda really did intend to replace the sales disaster that is the NSX?

Did they not invent the non-existant NSX-R GT to keep interest in racing a 15 year old car?

Why did they stop the HSC, and replace it with the ASC, a car that made even less sense from a sales perspective?

After it was shown and hated, did the ASC project go forward only to "match" Toyota's efforts?

Two years after the show car, we saw the crude S2000 test mule...Was it a next-gen S2000 test mule?

Why did the S2000 test mule have British plates? And off by a digit, front to back?

Why don't the plates come from the area where the F1 team is located?

Why is KGP the only source of information/spy pictures?

Do you really think that the ASC ring car broke the record on the first time on the track?

How did KGP get a lap time of 7:37, but no photos at/near the start finish line?

How do KGP know to be at the track entrance when the car shows up, and in front of the skunk-werks shop when the car arrives home?

Why are the "spy" photos taken from inside the track, six feet away from the track?

Why are there photos of the car with a "Corvette in testing" just in back, surely manufacturers don't race prototypes around the same track at the same time, back-to-back?

Why discontinue a limited edition "halo"/GT race car that is production ready, and already an unofficial Nurburgring spankmeister?

Why delay V-8 developement until 2015, when GM may go under next month?

Why develope so many prototypes that will never see the "light of day"?

I'll ask you, why? Surely you've thought about it enough...why do you think?

 

[MAJOR STONER]

When Honda began to become a serious threat to the US carmakers, forces in the US created Acura. Acura controls of the distribution of any high-end Honda product that is competition to a US made car.

The HSC was a Japanese rear-engine Honda design, The ASC is a front-engine American Acura design. Two completely different approaches.

What happened in 2005 that caused Acura to take over flagship design?

Back in 2005, Honda Director Fukui gave an interview to a foreign (Indonesian?) journalist, in which he made some controversial statements.

The interview disappeared from the internet quickly, as did all traces of it, shortly thereafter.

After I copied the article and it disapeared, I thought I may need some proof of origin in the future.

I grabbed a screenshot of a google search shortly after the transcript disappeared, a censored version posted below.

It could be that Fukui upset the powers that be, and has had his wings clipped by forces in the US ever since.

This would explain the absence of any sightings of the new NSX in Japan, and the timing seems to coincide with when things started to go horribly wrong for our NSX prototype.

This also may help to explain why Honda supplies GM with engines, offers On-Star, and a few other oddities.

Looks like he delayed the V-8 to help save GM, now he gets an award from an american automobile magazine.



Today, Honda is considering layoffs...Back in Feb. 2008...
In an interview with Automotive News, Honda CEO Takeo Fukui made comments regarding the American market that conflicted with Carlos Ghosn's. While Nissan CEO talks about a recession, Takeo Fukui doesn’t foresee any downturn for this year.

http://www.petrol-head.com/2008/02/honda-ceo-optim.html

 

[Midnight_Raven]

When Honda began to become a serious threat to the US carmakers, forces in the US created Acura. Acura controls of the distribution of any high-end Honda product that is competition to a US made car.

The HSC was a Japanese rear-engine Honda design, The ASC is a front-engine American Acura design. Two completely different approaches.

What happened in 2005 that caused Acura to take over flagship design?

Back in 2005, Honda Director Fukui gave an interview to a foreign (Indonesian?) journalist, in which he made some controversial statements.

The interview disappeared from the internet quickly, as did all traces of it, shortly thereafter.

After I copied the article and it disapeared, I thought I may need some proof of origin in the future.

I grabbed a screenshot of a google search shortly after the transcript disappeared, a censored version posted below.

It could be that Fukui upset the powers that be, and has had his wings clipped by forces in the US ever since.

This would explain the absence of any sightings of the new NSX in Japan, and the timing seems to coincide with when things started to go horribly wrong for our NSX prototype.

This also may help to explain why Honda supplies GM with engines, offers On-Star, and a few other oddities.

Looks like he delayed the V-8 to help save GM, now he gets an award from an american automobile magazine.



Today, Honda is considering layoffs...Back in Feb. 2008...
In an interview with Automotive News, Honda CEO Takeo Fukui made comments regarding the American market that conflicted with Carlos Ghosn's. While Nissan CEO talks about a recession, Takeo Fukui doesn’t foresee any downturn for this year.

http://www.petrol-head.com/2008/02/honda-ceo-optim.html

So are you implying that the US government is in a way threatening Honda so our own car companies start to profit again? If you do have a clip of that indonesian article.. I would be interested in reading it although I don't know if you can translate it or something since I don't know indonesian.

 

[WingZ]

Probably not, you wanted the ASCC. You were one of the very few that wanted it in fact. Didn't you say you didn't like the HSC ?

No and I've never said anything to that effect. I like both the HSC and the ASCC. Plus why would I start this thread if I didn't like the HSC

When Honda began to become a serious threat to the US carmakers, forces in the US created Acura. Acura controls of the distribution of any high-end Honda product that is competition to a US made car.

The HSC was a Japanese rear-engine Honda design, The ASC is a front-engine American Acura design. Two completely different approaches.

What happened in 2005 that caused Acura to take over flagship design?

Back in 2005, Honda Director Fukui gave an interview to a foreign (Indonesian?) journalist, in which he made some controversial statements.

The interview disappeared from the internet quickly, as did all traces of it, shortly thereafter.

After I copied the article and it disapeared, I thought I may need some proof of origin in the future.

I grabbed a screenshot of a google search shortly after the transcript disappeared, a censored version posted below.

It could be that Fukui upset the powers that be, and has had his wings clipped by forces in the US ever since.

This would explain the absence of any sightings of the new NSX in Japan, and the timing seems to coincide with when things started to go horribly wrong for our NSX prototype.

This also may help to explain why Honda supplies GM with engines, offers On-Star, and a few other oddities.

Looks like he delayed the V-8 to help save GM, now he gets an award from an american automobile magazine.



Today, Honda is considering layoffs...Back in Feb. 2008...
In an interview with Automotive News, Honda CEO Takeo Fukui made comments regarding the American market that conflicted with Carlos Ghosn's. While Nissan CEO talks about a recession, Takeo Fukui doesn’t foresee any downturn for this year.

http://www.petrol-head.com/2008/02/honda-ceo-optim.html

Well in Feb 08 Honda was starting to have a record breaking year. Hondas tend to sell well in a recession due to them being considered practical and less expensive so they probably thought sales would continue to be good. The credit crunch is what hit Honda and others sales wise.

Takeo is apparently a pretty feisty guy and after reading this article I can imagine him saying something that would raise eyebrows
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/12/22/honda-could-move-headquarters-outside-of-japan/

There's no speculation at all concerning Acuras creation. The forces responsible for Acuras creation were Japanese response to then American prejudice and following American Marketing techniques. Acura was made so that Honda could sell higher priced vehicles .. period. The Acura Legend was the first Japanese car to crack the $20k barrier as at that point 85 or 86 I believe people would only pay so much for Japanese car.

So modeling after Cadillac , Lincoln ( in business practice ) Honda decided to make a higher line of vehicles based off some of their lower priced cars. It worked to a large extent and provided the way for Toyota and Nissan to do the same. Mazda was also going to do this using a brand name of "Amati" I believe it was but they had some problems and aborted. The sedan called the Mazda Millenia was developed to be the flagship of that brand and since it was ready to go it was just sold as a Mazda.

As far as the HSC Fukui cancelled it as it was considered to "only slightly better performance than the NSX" because he felt quote "that the car wouldn't be competitive enough with a 350+ hp V6". True enough the HP wars were starting again Honda decided to jump into the front engine high hp car market instead.

Also just for reference most people including most primers weren't excited about the HSC. It didn't get the outright disdain that people showed the ASCC but due to HP ratings people were disappointed. It was ironically enough considered to be only an "Evolutionary" upgrade ( yeah cracks me up now to see people posting they wish Honda had done evolutionary changes to the NSX ) I saw the HSC in person at the Detroit autoshow and not that many people were around it. I was in LOVE and thought it was perfect! I was actually a bit heart broken when the ax came down on it:frown:

The reason we keep having Acura problems is because Acura has been telling Honda what to do for the "American" market and it doesn't seem that most Americans like what Acura keeps putting out so there's enormous internal strife from what I constantly hear. They wanted Honda to drop the S2K and build them a Boxster competitor. They wanted to drop the RSX so they could be more "upscale". They really are all over the place and because of that are having a hard time finding their place. Meanwhile Honda takes the hit as everyone keeps thinking that's where Acura decisions come from LOL

 

[Ponyboy]

The evidence of sportscars unseen:biggrin:

LOL - that made me snort.

Personally, I wasn't a big fan of the HSC especially with it having a small V6. In my heart, I believe Honda will produce a true NSX replacement but not until I'm in my 50s (30s) now.

 

[WingZ]

LOL - that made me snort.

Personally, I wasn't a big fan of the HSC especially with it having a small V6. In my heart, I believe Honda will produce a true NSX replacement but not until I'm in my 50s (30s) now.

Yeah most NSX people weren't. There wasn't really too much lamenting on prime when it was canceled ... except a few of us:frown:

 

[NSXGMS]

Yeah most NSX people weren't. There wasn't really too much lamenting on prime when it was canceled ... except a few of us:frown:

This is true but most thought the HSC would be cancelled in lieu of a better design. Of course we all would have gladly taken the HSC if we had known there would be no NSX replacement as promised. But I think the lukewarm reactions at the time--which I do vividly recall and agree with you about--would have been brought around by a better engine (which it absolutely needed) and a few minor body tweaks (which are easily done--some even photoshopped by us on Prime).

When Honda began to become a serious threat to the US carmakers, forces in the US created Acura. Acura controls of the distribution of any high-end Honda product that is competition to a US made car.

The HSC was a Japanese rear-engine Honda design, The ASC is a front-engine American Acura design. Two completely different approaches.

What happened in 2005 that caused Acura to take over flagship design?

Back in 2005, Honda Director Fukui gave an interview to a foreign (Indonesian?) journalist, in which he made some controversial statements.

The interview disappeared from the internet quickly, as did all traces of it, shortly thereafter.

After I copied the article and it disapeared, I thought I may need some proof of origin in the future.

I grabbed a screenshot of a google search shortly after the transcript disappeared, a censored version posted below.

It could be that Fukui upset the powers that be, and has had his wings clipped by forces in the US ever since.

This would explain the absence of any sightings of the new NSX in Japan, and the timing seems to coincide with when things started to go horribly wrong for our NSX prototype.

This also may help to explain why Honda supplies GM with engines, offers On-Star, and a few other oddities.

Looks like he delayed the V-8 to help save GM, now he gets an award from an american automobile magazine.



Today, Honda is considering layoffs...Back in Feb. 2008...
In an interview with Automotive News, Honda CEO Takeo Fukui made comments regarding the American market that conflicted with Carlos Ghosn's. While Nissan CEO talks about a recession, Takeo Fukui doesn’t foresee any downturn for this year.

http://www.petrol-head.com/2008/02/honda-ceo-optim.html

I don't read anything into the HSC-Honda ASC-Acura thing. The NSX was a Honda there and an Acura here and since the decision was made to release Acura worldwide after the HSC was axed I'm not surprised they chose to introduce the ASC as an Acura.

As far as Fukui's comments in Feb 08 no one could have predicted the severity and length of the current conditions. Fukui certainly had no idea. The possibility of a deal being struck with Fukui to delay a V-8 seems unlikely and bizarre. Not that it couldn't happen, but I doubt it.

 

[supra2nv]

very interesting thread.

by the way, if the HSC is produced, I will do everything I can to own one....

 

[GoSpeedGo]

I had the pleasure of seeing the HSC in person several years ago at the Tokyo Motor Show. The car is far more appealing in person than in the pictures. It certainly gave a sense of performance and arrival. To me it was a very clear step forward while still remaining very true to the heritage of the past. I can assure most who really appreciate the NSX cars we have today, you would have an affinity for the HSC. Especially compared to what they had running around the Nurburgring.

 

[Midnight_Raven]

Yeah most NSX people weren't. There wasn't really too much lamenting on prime when it was canceled ... except a few of us:frown:

And it funny because now alot of people keep commenting how they wish the HSC was made but at the time of it's appearance they didn't like it.

 

[Spooler]

Interesting opinion's..good reading them

Suppose if Honda took this approach if they are so worried about the bottom line.....

Why not take the catchy name "NSX" and the legendary status of the original as a basis for:An NSX for the Masses.

That's right !..forget about the Hp wars and the ridiculous price tags and make a car that slots right in with the Nissan's. Customers' can have a choice of Gas or Hybrid powerplants.

Think of it, NSX's all over the place like G-35's :biggrin:

spooler