ABS Bleed not working - ???

[pgilliam1]

I just bled my ABS and it went well - I thought. I got alot of white-ish foam at first then it became clear and clean. I took the car for a test ride and the ABS motor would not stop. It ran for the 120 secs. and cut off and the ABS light came on. When I got back from the test drive the reservoir was empty. I rebled the system and more white foam. I ran the car again and same 120 secs and off. I then tried to flush the solenoids. 2 of them returned foam to the reservoir when activated but 2 of them didn't do anything even though I could hear them activating. Another test drive and this time the ABS motor stopped after several hard stops (again upon return the reservoir was empty - does this cause air in the system? - and I am filling it to max before driving). But now the motor runs for about 5 to 6 seconds after engaging the ABS and it did not do that before.
Any ideas - Please? And please no "just disconnect the POS thing" comments.
Thank You

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Tell me your bleed procedure.

Regards,
LarryB

 

[pgilliam1]

Tell me your bleed procedure.

Regards,
LarryB

Pretty straight forward:
-Remove motor relay
-Connect a switch to botton connectors of relay socket
-Suck out old fluid from ABS reservoir and refill with good
-loosen maintenance bleed screw until fluid quits - then retighten it
-close the switch to the motor relay socket for 30 secs
-loosen bleed screw until fliud stops - then retighten it
-do this until only good fluid comes out
-refill reservoir and test drive

All of it went well except I think the ABS motor is supposed to start slowing when the fluid is under pressure, and that never happened.

Your Input is Appreciated!

 

[OLDMNSX]

I'm with Larry B, but it sounds like all you have done is bleed the accumulator and the first part of the modulator. You have just done the first step. What you need to do is to bleed the air out of the solenoids. If you will take a look at this site http://www.danoland.com/nsxgarage and copy the DIY on bleeding of the ABS I bet that you will have a lot more luck. You can also read some of the replys that I have posted on the ABS system. The biggest thing that I have found that DanO didn't include in his procedures is that you need to keep the aerated fluid from getting into the fresh fluid going into the pump and being pressurized. You can find some of my pictures that show the fixtures that I use in my bleeding procedure. My tools are currently in Tampa, FL otherwise I would send them to you to do the job.

Read this thread and then report back: http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98758

I was in Phoenix a couple weeks ago and helped a friend, Dan, bleed his ABS. It fixed it. He was very pleased to say the least. Let me know if you need any other help. Don't let this get you down. This really isn't a big deal. Where do you live, I get around the country? (ID, WA, AZ, DC, FL, TX etc) Who knows the ABS tools may be coming to a city near you!

Brad

 

[NSXclear]

-Make sure you close the switch to the motor relay socket for 30 secs one last time, before you take your drive.
-After closing the switch, fill up the reservoir again.
-Take your drive
-Check reservoir again.

 

[nigel]

pgilliam1,
You've got the two smartest and most experienced NSX/brake people around working with you. Do what they say and you'll get it sorted.
Now you see why I want to construct a bleed systen "special tool" to make this job easier.
OLDMNSX is the guy I told you about that made the excelent bleed system i'm trying to duplicate as soon as I get the rest of the parts.

Brad, pilligam1 "gave" me a master cylinder assy. to have the reseviour to get the parts to build a bleed system for the east coast.
When I get my hands on a manifold and valve assy. i'll be getting ahold for the rest of the instructions. I already made copies of the instructions and pictures you posted along time ago.

Cheers
nigel

 

[Larry Bastanza]

All is fine until you got to step #8

Pretty straight forward:
1-Remove motor relay
2-Connect a switch to botton connectors of relay socket
3-Suck out old fluid from ABS reservoir and refill with good
4-loosen maintenance bleed screw until fluid quits - then retighten it
5-close the switch to the motor relay socket for 30 secs
6-loosen bleed screw until fliud stops - then retighten it
7-do this until only good fluid comes out
8-refill reservoir
9-close the switch to the motor relay socket for 30 secs
10-top off reservoir
11-close the switch to the motor relay socket for 30 secs
12-and test drive

Brad mentions the selonoids and he is right on. Above is a method to bleed only, not clear the selonoids.

vsy05 has mentioned above the same as I describe. When the system is empty it can take longer then the 120 sec. the system allows to pressurize. Your original method started with the system internally empty, that is your issue.

HTH,
LarryB

 

[pgilliam1]

What I did wrong.

I did NOT let the pump reach pressure. I ran the ABS motor for 30 seconds (once) and then bled the fluid from the mainteance bleeder. Some fluid did come out so I thought I was doing it correctly (as I said, my pump never slowed down during the procedure). However, I needed to repeat (it took 4 times) running the motor until it got pressure and then bleed the fluid. I bled the solenoids a few times each until I got it right, so "excersized" they are. The test drive went fine and the car is back to operating like it was before I started.

What is normal? My ABS pump runs for about 3 seconds after I hard brake. As you know it's a bad humming/clicking sound - don't like it a bit.

Your suggestions and ideas also answered a few other questions I had, like why it seems my front tires are subject to the ABS sytem but not my rear tires. The owner before me thought it would be cool to put 285/40/18's on the rear and 225/45/17's on the front. Well it does look cool but the understeer is increased quite a bit and who knows what that does to axle strain, etc.

I really appreciate all your input - Thanks to All!

 

[pgilliam1]

I was in Phoenix a couple weeks ago and helped a friend, Dan, bleed his ABS. It fixed it. He was very pleased to say the least. Let me know if you need any other help. Don't let this get you down. This really isn't a big deal. Where do you live, I get around the country? (ID, WA, AZ, DC, FL, TX etc) Who knows the ABS tools may be coming to a city near you!

Brad[/quote]


Thanks for the offer. I'm in St. Louis. If you're in my neck of the woods PM me and I'll show you around town.

Pat

 

[zacks91nsx]

I'm with Larry B, but it sounds like all you have done is bleed the accumulator and the first part of the modulator. You have just done the first step. What you need to do is to bleed the air out of the solenoids.

I have a question on this, My 91 will not stop pumping everytime I let it set for longer then a hour, then I have to lock it up to shut it up. I did bleed the abs but didn't do the solenoids thing. When I did bleed the system it would be good for like a 4 or 5 days then I would have to lock up the breaks again. Could this be the cause? and is it only the 2 clips?

 

[OLDMNSX]

I did bleed the abs but didn't do the solenoids thing.

Yes, you need to do this. One of the solenoids is seeping and needs to be cycled numerous times to reseat.

and is it only the 2 clips?

Not sure what you are asking here. There are four solenoids that will have to be flushed. You can't tell which one is seeping without pressurizing the system, removing the reservoir, removing the piece that the reservoir set on and watching the top of the solenoids to see which one is leaking the fluid. It is much easier to do the flush procedure and see if that takes care of the problem. You probably still have air in the system and for sure have a seeping solenoid.

Did you read the whole thread, that I listed the link, in my previous reply to this thread?
Brad

 

[pgilliam1]

I have a question on this, My 91 will not stop pumping everytime I let it set for longer then a hour, then I have to lock it up to shut it up. I did bleed the abs but didn't do the solenoids thing. When I did bleed the system it would be good for like a 4 or 5 days then I would have to lock up the breaks again. Could this be the cause? and is it only the 2 clips?

Only 2 wires needed to bleed the solenoids - negative and positive (from the battery terminals). Have a couple of quarts of new brake fluid ready and a way to evacuate the reservoir as you will have a lot of white foamy fluid coming back into it when you apply power to the solenoid connector (don't forget to pull your ABS main relay first).

Good Luck!

 

[warrenw]

Yes, you need to do this. One of the solenoids is seeping and needs to be cycled numerous times to reseat.




Not sure what you are asking here. There are four solenoids that will have to be flushed. You can't tell which one is seeping without pressurizing the system, removing the reservoir, removing the piece that the reservoir set on and watching the top of the solenoids to see which one is leaking the fluid. It is much easier to do the flush procedure and see if that takes care of the problem. You probably still have air in the system and for sure have a seeping solenoid.

Did you read the whole thread, that I listed the link, in my previous reply to this thread?
Brad

I have one solenoid that continues to be a problem. About twice a year I need to exercise that one seeping returns about every 6 months. I have quick connect cable harness to just plug in, exercise, turkey baste, refill fluid and it is good again. The other three are never an issue.

 

[zacks91nsx]

I was able to bleed Solenoids today and the first 3 I did look fine no foam, when I got to the last one sounded like air was in it but still no foam, drove it around the block and lock it up a few times level was fine, and no more noises.

Thank you everyone