15/16 Wheels at track 18/19 Normally

[len3.8]

All I have question. I currently have a 95 NSX-t I have a question about wheels. Specifics: exchanging wheels when I am at the track and alignment. I have a set of oem 15/16's and regularly ride on 18/19's I want to know if I am asking for an headache when I put the 15/16's on?
The 18/19's are 225/35/18 and the 275/30/19
What sizes would you guys run on the fronts to maintain like or better stability?
Any suggestions are welcomed. I have checked the faq's as well as searched archives. I have some info about what tires are best, what alignment specs would be best.
Thanks
Len

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by len3.8:
I have a set of oem 15/16's and regularly ride on 18/19's I want to know if I am asking for an headache when I put the 15/16's on?

No, not at all. The smaller wheels should work fine. Plus, there is a wide selection of track tires available in the 15"/16" OEM sizes. Stability and handling should be just as good in those sizes as the 18"/19" sizes you are running now.

One additional advantage of the 15"/16" OEM sizes is that you will be able to fit the set of four wheels/tires inside the car to take them with you to the track.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 05 March 2003).]

 

[matteni]

Hi Len,

I personally love the Yoko A032s on the stock 15/16 for the track.

They are great for the price, good dry performance, surprisingly good wet performance, and (never thought I would say this about a Yoko) hold up pretty well for track rubber. I actually drove them all the way up to Gingerman (7 hours), thrashed them on the track ALL day, drove home and they still have over 50% tred (oh and did I mention I allready had 2 D.E.'s on them)

I run a little wider then stock but the stock sizes work fine too. I found the wider tires are not much more weight and tend to stick a little better but the difference is nominal. I did have the extra factory "heat cycle" done. I was talked into this by the Tire Rack as they say it helps the tire last 30% longer and they may be on to something (or maybe I drive like a Grandma on the track - I don't know)

I used to love the old "G Force" tires but the redesign a couple of years ago chased a lot of us off. Plus the G Force were aweful in the rain. I must say they did stick a little better in the dry then the Yoko's but who likes having to switch tires at the last second and going back to stock?

For the ultimate grip - the Hoosiers can't be beat in the dry and are really the premier track rubber for the dry IMO if money is no object (they are a LOT more).

Anyway - that is one opinion and you know what they say about opinions.

------------------
Nick M

91' Red/Black with Many Mods
99' Honda Odyssey with Many Kids

 

[len3.8]

Well thanks Gents.
Nick what size tire are you running?
I am looking at the yoko's as well.
Is your car lowered?

Ken, what tires are you using on the tracks. I know you have been to many of tracks including my home track.

Len

 

[nsxtasy]

Hi Len,

I personally love the Yoko A032s on the stock 15/16 for the track.

Oh wait, Nick already said that. But I agree with him 100 percent.

I use the A032R in the stock sizes, 205/50-15 front and 225/50-16 rear. I stuff them inside the car*, so I'm not driving them to or from the track like I guess Nick is. They stick great, and if I have to drive from the track to the hotel on them at the end of the day in the rain, it's no big deal. Nick's right, they last a long time. I got well over 1000 actual track miles on the A032R in my Integra Type R, which is incredibly long life for a track tire. (I haven't yet used up a set on the NSX so I can't tell you how many track miles I'll get.) If you're in competition where you care about every last hundredth of a second, then you might want the Hoosier R3S03, but otherwise, the Yokohamas are really great for a track tire.

*Put tires in 33-gallon leaf bags. Rear tire in the trunk, along with track junk. Slide passenger seat full forward, front tire behind seat. Slide passenger seat back again (won't go very far). Other two tires on top of seat, standing up.

 

[docjohn]

I agree with the above.I'm assuming you don't have the stock 16/17 wheels for your car?The front 16 in. wheel limits fitment,so you are better off 15/16.I would also look at the pilot sport cup and toyo ra-1 hopefuly there will be more nsx friendly sized r rubber in the near future.

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Ken,

You have mentioned the tire carrying method before. I have been meaning to ask: Do you have a harness bar?

Thanks,
LarryB

 

[matteni]

Hi Larry / Ken / Len,

I have a Dali Harness bar (not sure the model number) and I also run wider then stock on the 15/16 and I still am able to get them all in the car (it is very tight). I did have to put a 15 in the trunk and the rest up front (did I mention it is tight!)

Len - I am running 245/45?/16s in the rear and 225/??/15 up front with no TCS problems - I really need to look at the tires to be 100% sure - I will try to remember tonight to check and post.

------------------
Nick M

91' Red/Black with Many Mods
99' Honda Odyssey with Many Kids

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by Larry Bastanza:
Do you have a harness bar?

No.

Incidentally, the Yokohama A032R and the Hoosier R3S03 tend to be the two "extremes" among track rubber, with the Hoosiers the absolute fastest in the dry vs the Yokos the longest lasting and not too bad in the wet. The Kumhos (the Ecsta V700 and the V700 Victoracer) are somewhere in the middle in all characteristics. I haven't heard too many reports yet about the tires that John mentioned, the Toyo RA-1 or the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup, which is new, to hear where they fall along that spectrum.

 

[fangtl]

Hi len, the V700s (courtesy of Ken) were very nice in the short time I used them. They were stock 15/16 OEM sizes.

My '92 was lowered with Eibachs w/ the early NSX alignment, no rubbing or TCS issues at all.

 

[len3.8]

Originally posted by fangtl:
Hi len, the V700s (courtesy of Ken) were very nice in the short time I used them. They were stock 15/16 OEM sizes.

My '92 was lowered with Eibachs w/ the early NSX alignment, no rubbing or TCS issues at all.

Again thanks to all of you for the good points. I have decided to use the wheels as track wheels. I am going to use either the Yok's or the Kuhmo's (SP).
Thanks again
Len

 

[matteni]

OK Len - I am running 205/50/R15 Fronts and 255/50/R16 (edit was 15 and corrected to 16) rears at 32 pounds cold for the track.

I wanted a slightly bigger rear to overcome some perceived understear at the limit.

I am running:
- Eibach springs
- Bilstein Monotube shocks
- Dali street / race Sway Bars
- Al Terpak Sway Bar Collars
- "newer" (94+?) allignment settings

Hope this helps

------------------
Nick M

91' Red/Black with Many Mods
99' Honda Odyssey with Many Kids

[This message has been edited by matteni (edited 07 March 2003).]

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by matteni:
255/50/R16 rears

I would strongly advise NOT using way oversized tires at one end like that. I recommend sticking to the OEM sizes, with 225/50-16 in the rear.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 07 March 2003).]

 

[len3.8]

Okay guys, I was thinking 225/50/15 and 245/45/16's. Am I thinking too big?
Len

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by len3.8:
Okay guys, I was thinking 225/50/15 and 245/45/16's. Am I thinking too big?

I wouldn't use those sizes. And I don't...

 

[docjohn]

Matteni,I'm not sure of the logic of using a larger rear tire to reduce understeer,putting more rubber in back while keeping the front size stable will promote understeer,otherwise called a push.

 

[nsxtasy]

Originally posted by docjohn:
Matteni,I'm not sure of the logic of using a larger rear tire to reduce understeer,putting more rubber in back while keeping the front size stable will promote understeer,otherwise called a push.

That's what I thought, too... but not everyone agrees on that. Most, but not all, claim that wider tires mean more traction in corners so that wider rear means more understeer, while there are some who claim that wider tires mean less traction in corners so that wider rear means less understeer. Go figure.

In any case, I wouldn't increase one end by 30 mm and not the other end at all...

 

[matteni]

I edited my sizes above. When I get my next set of tires in May I will go back to stock sizes - if for no other reason then being able to more "easily" get them back in the car!

Ironically - I really thought I had ordered the sizes Len was contimplating - I wonder now if I got different sizes then what I ordered as I don't know why I would have ordered 205/50/15s and 255/50/16s. That said I did not notice a lot of push and actually thought I was experiancing more oversteer at Gingerman last year.

Adding to the controversy - when I went to Gingerman for many of the sessions I had a 230 lb passenger and with him the car felt very ballanced. Without him - I felt a more "oversteer" condition.

Confused? Me too. My advice - start with the stock sizes for your first set and if you percieve a shorcoming - alter from there.

[This message has been edited by matteni (edited 07 March 2003).]

 

[len3.8]

Guys, Thanks Ken as always a wealth of knowledge. I am lucky to have the stock sizes still on these wheels. I am going to put them on this weekend to see if my car will be too low to the ground, due to the car being lowered, and the existing body kit.
I appreciate all of the timely input.
Len

[This message has been edited by len3.8 (edited 07 March 2003).]

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Nick,

A little speculation here, but I think maybe your passenger made your corner balance better.

Since you have the shock/spring setup you do weight changes are the only way to effect that.

If you (the car!!) ever have an oppurtunity to get on scales it would be very telling

MY $.02,
LarryB

 

[Andrie Hartanto]

When I ran 15/16 wheels. I like to use 205/50/15 and 245/45/16. Car feels good with that size. However, as my skill improves, I find lower sidewall are necessary to give more instantaneous feedback.

 

[len3.8]

Originally posted by Andrie Hartanto:
When I ran 15/16 wheels. I like to use 205/50/15 and 245/45/16. Car feels good with that size. However, as my skill improves, I find lower sidewall are necessary to give more instantaneous feedback.

Andrie what other tires have you tried on your car with the lower side walls?
Did you ever use larger sizes on the 15/16.
I notice that you are on the track a lot.
Len