Trailering with the NSX

Opening up this new thread to consolidate discussion on towing a track trailer with the NSX. As several folks have gathered, an interesting option for carrying track tires, tools, etc would be to tow a small track trailer.

Wanted to consolidate a few of these.

(a) tow hitch options -- see link below (thanks, JeffA)

(b) trailers -- the "prior" standard is the track trailer previously made/sold by Southsport Trailers. For some reason these are no longer on the market, although it seems that several other options (including DIY using parts from HarborFreight) are coming out

(c) stuff you'd carry -- toolboxes, tire carriers, compact racing jacks... numerous threads on these out there, which I'll hope to cross-reference later.

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One current "tow hitch" thread : http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39774

This one started out as a "how to carry track tires in the car", but has now evolved into a "hitch" discussion, thanks to contributions from JeffA and Tank, who have successfully mounted hitches onto their cars.

Here's a re-post of the pic of JeffA's setup

Re: Trailer

FYI, a nice writeup on track trailers in general at http://www.pca.org/hcp/de_trailer.htm

They refer to the Southsport trailer in there, but also talk about some DIY setups. Sounds like DIY is the way to go, particularly if you have special requirements, and its often less $$$ involved.

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The trailer was the next major step in the project. I chose to build my trailer from a kit rather than a purpose built unit from SouthSport as it would provide additional room for extra tires or gas cans. I purchased my trailer over the Internet from Armor Rex - www.armorrex.com. The model is the LCI-832T Small Compact Utility Trailer with 14-inch tires. It cost about $280 with freight and arrived in 3 boxes. I was impressed with the quality of the components and the fastening hardware. If you weren't into Erector Sets as a kid, you might want to consider a SouthSport.

After assembling the kit I added a deck made from marine plywood. I purchased a large plastic tool chest, and made a tire rack out of angle iron. The photos of the trailer should provide an idea of how to go about constructing the tire rack. A 2x4 in front and 4x4 behind the tires forms a cradle to hold the tires. It is important to note that the angle iron rack is for backup safety reasons and does not actually hold the tires. The ratcheting luggage straps are what hold the tires firmly in the cradle on the trailer bed. You must use these and make sure you tighten them down snugly!

Balancing the trailer is very important. I tried to have 40-50 lbs of downward force on the trailer tongue when the tongue is at hitch level. You can check this with your bathroom scale. The main variable for balance is the position of the toolbox and what you have in it. I positioned the toolbox on the back of the trailer so that I could fit two tires sideways between it and the other four tires or gas cans. What is nice about this setup is the balance of the trailer does not change whether the gas cans are full or empty since they are positioned over the trailer axle.

Seems like the Southsport folks have taken down their website ( www.southsporttrailers.com/track.html ). Anyone have any more current contact info ?? S Florida folks ??

South Sport Trailers Inc
(407) 330-2322
185 E Airport Blvd
Sanford, FL 32773

also found this addy on the Z06 boards: 3416 S.Orlando Dr

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Pulled these pix from a P928 site -- more like what I have in mind... bigger/studier toolbox, room for bigger/wider tires, etc.




I've seen cases (mostly Porsche and Viper / Prowler folks) who even color-match their trailers to their cars.

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TRAILEX sells a "Tire Toter" at http://www.trailex.com/viewprod.cfm?id=74&mcat=88&cat_id=88

THIS LIGHTWEIGHT ALUMINUM TRAILER IS FOR THE WEEKEND RACER THAT DOES NOT WANT A FULL CAR TRAILER. IT IS 4' X 6' AND WEIGHS ONLY 250 LBS. AVAILABLE WITH 1 OR 2 TIRE RACKS EACH RACK HOLDS UP TO 4 WHEELS AND TIRES. YOU CAN ALSO BOLT YOUR OWN TOOL OR STORAGE BOX TO OUR TRAILER. COMES WITH LOCK TO PROTECT THE VALUABLE WHEELS.

Thanx Manuel, this is nice.

(update as of 9/10/2004)

The technical DIY document I wrote on how to add the class 1 hitch and wire the NSX to the trailer and build the trailer is going to be published in the NSCXA magazine/newsletter NSX Driver. When it hits the streets, I will start up a thread in the Technical/DIY forum here on NSXPrime, to have a place to discuss it and answer questions.

About a month after the mag hits the streets, I will make available the original 17 page Word document to whoever wants it, free.

Jeff

Re: another hitch fitment

A few pix of another NSX hitch fitment, courtesy of Tom "Tank"

mock-up shot of his setup (trailer not loaded)



shot of hitch receiver, sans tongue



with tongue installed



fully hooked up, with hitch, wiring harness and safety chains



I'll post more detail pix later.

Hitch is from "Hitch Crafters" in Costa Mesa CA -- phone 949-548-3000.
Tom tells me they do first class work.

"They aren't cheap but nothing - and I mean NOTHING - comes back to them. They do it right the first time every time. The wiring for the trailer brake/running lights was factory quality."

Re: Tom T's hitch -- more details

More details on Tom's setup.

Close-ups of hitch receiver, showing "hole" and wiring harness connectors.



Receiver comes through a small hole cut in the lower rear valance. The assembly to the left of the hitch is the wiring harness (plugged-up when not in use). Pretty neat.



Hitch receiver close-ups -- will try to get more "specs" from Hitch Crafters <s>Masters</s> later.



Hitch receiver is welded to the bumper and also (having cut the access hole) to the "frame". It looks like some of the heat-shield is also peeled back to get to the frame members above the exhaust.




Tom added the carabiners to provide an easier way to hookup the safety chains -- don't have to reach so far under the bumper to attach them to the hitch.

What is the maximum trailer weight and tongue weight that can be handled by the NSX with this hitch?

That's a good question. I'm not sure if you're inquiring about Tanks' setup or mine. But, my opinion is it needs to be a VERY LIGHTWEIGHT trailer. These track tire trailers are in the range of 300 to 500 lbs total weight, with very minimal tongue weights.

The NSX itself has a "maximum payload" weight of only 400 lbs, if you look at the doc that comes with the car. Then there is this warning in the owner's manual:

1992 NSX Owners Manual, Page 123: “Your NSX is not designed to tow a trailer. Trying to do so can void your warranties. Attempting to install a trailer hitch on your NSX can cause serious damage to it’s undercarriage”.

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So, my personal opinion is that 500 lbs total tow weight is where I would stop. I feel that 1,000 lbs is too much.

My $0.02.

Jeff

Jeff A said:

That's a good question. I'm not sure if you're inquiring about Tanks' setup or mine. But, my opinion is it needs to be a VERY LIGHTWEIGHT trailer. These track tire trailers are in the range of 300 to 500 lbs total weight, with very minimal tongue weights.

The NSX itself has a "maximum payload" weight of only 400 lbs, if you look at the doc that comes with the car. Then there is this warning in the owner's manual:
So, my personal opinion is that 500 lbs total tow weight is where I would stop. I feel that 1,000 lbs is too much.

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That sounds reasonable... most small trailer setups I've used shoot for a tongue weight of the order of 10% of the total trailer weight. So a tongue in the 40-50 lbs would be about right, given Jeff's estimation.

- Trailer itself is pretty light. Trailer + bed + spare + tire rack = 60-80 lbs
- 4 wheels and tires: ~ 180-200 lbs for a typical 17/17 setup (see FAQ)
- lightweight racing jack: 20-30 lbs
- toolbox with tools: ~30-40 lbs

Even with gas cans and oil, brake fluid, pads, you're still well under 400 lbs.
Add a cooler full of goodies and you're still well under 500.

Tank, JeffA -- any comment on the above #s ??

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PS -- nsxr1 : the NSX will definitely NOT tow your R1, although it'd be a cool "batmobile - batcycle" combo if it could

nsx1164 -

I must admit, the possibility of towing my R1 had occurred to me briefly a while back , but I dismissed it after reading in the owner's manual that attaching a hitch to the NSX might damage the undercarriage. Then when I read this thread, I got curious again. But even if the NSX could handle the 385 lbs of the bike plus the weight of a small folding trailer, it would still be impracticle because there would be insufficient room for all the other gear required for a track event (helmet, leathers, tools, fuel, spare parts, EZ-UP, etc...). Guess I'll have to buy a used Toyota truck...

nsx1164 said:

- Trailer itself is pretty light. Trailer + bed + spare + tire rack = 60-80 lbs
- 4 wheels and tires: ~ 180-200 lbs for a typical 17/17 setup (see FAQ)
- lightweight racing jack: 20-30 lbs
- toolbox with tools: ~30-40 lbs

Click to expand...

Those are good numbers. Although my Kumho Victoracers and Volk TE 37s aren't as heavy as what's listed above but my trailer is, so it evens out. It's also good to remember that the trailer has to be balanced so that tongue weight is minimal. The way mine ended up I don't put much in the tool box. My racing jack goes in the trunk, cooler in the front seat. And it sort of goes without saying, you do not want a passenger in the car while towing. I've had this set-up for almost 2 years with at least one outing a month and it's been without a problem.

Again, for those of us working alone and with minimal space at home, this is one way to get by.

Tank said:

And it sort of goes without saying, you do not want a passenger in the car while towing.

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Interesting... so does the recommended "400 lb total payload" recommendation includes:
- driver weight
- stuff in passenger seat (note: this may be a person)
- stuff in trunk
- trailer TONGUE weight

Is this correct ??

Yes, that's what I had always assumed - 400 pounds of total weight is what is specified, which includes driver and occupant/cargo. I was surprised when I read it, it was on a label inside the driver's door or in the owner's manual, I forget which.

I searched around on the 'net for a while, and could find nothing more on the subject.

Jeff

The GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) of the 1991 NSX is 3550 pounds. So the capacity for occupants, luggage, and optional equipment, above the 3010 pound curb weight (weight with all standard equipment and full fluids), is 440 pounds.

Manuel - Talk with Phil about driving a fully-loaded NSX cross-country. Even without a trailer, the 400 pounds of load was enough to make the tires wear much, much faster than normal (and "normal" is pretty fast already)...

Re: small track trailer

A friend of mine recommended this trailer from HarborFreight

ITEM 90153-4VGA
3-1/3 FT. x 4 FT. MINI UTILITY TRAILER

was $219.99 -- now on sale @ $179.99

- 1075 LB. CAPACITY
- DOT certified tires, rims, tail lights, fenders and safety chains
- Three leaf spring suspension (not all have this!)
- 4.80-12 tires (good for towing)
- Easy assembly with household tools

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=90153

Re: small track trailer

nsx1164 said:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=90153

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That's the one I have as well as several other people I race with. Easy to build.

t

Northern Tool has the small utility trailer with 8" wheels and 12" wheels. That one (with the 12" wheels) will certainly work. However, from the research I did, there are actually 3 reasons not to go with it.

One is that it's built with bigger springs and bigger tires, so that it can haul more weight (a full half-ton). So it's heavier. With the severe weight limitation that the NSX has, we need it to be as light weight as possible.

2nd reason is that the springs are much stiffer (for the heavier load). The track tires don't load the springs enough to get in their elastic range, and I've read that the trailer bounces severely over bumps. One fellow solved it by disassembling the springs and removing one leaf. He said it then loaded the springs properly and stopped the excessive bouncing.

3rd reason is that the fenders stick up higher to clear the 12" wheels, and so can get in the way of the tire mounting, depending on how you design the tire mounts.

So I went with, and recommend, the one with 8" wheels. It does handle the bumps quite nicely.

Can you tell I get into this stuff?

Jeff

Guys -

There's been a little development in the situation of me releasing the technical DIY document I wrote on how to mount the hitch and connect to the NSX wiring and build the trailer.

The management of the NSXCA contacted me. They have reviewed the document and would like to publish it as an article in the NSX Driver magazine/newsletter. Understandably, they don't want to use already released content previously available on NSXPrime - that would just be publishing old news. They are a bunch of hard working volunteers, and I'm sure it's tough for them to come up with enough content for the mag. It's something that I can do for the club. They even pay an honorarium to the author, although it's not a huge sum.

Consequently, I agreed to not release it here first. It will be available in the NSX Driver magazine, I assume in the next issue, but I'm not sure exactly when that will happen. It'll be in color with all the pictures, and all NSXCA members will get a copy. Over 1,000 copies will be printed. I agreed to wait a month after the mag is published to publicly release my original 17 page Word document. So I will be giving the electronic document out, but not as soon as I had originally planned.

Manuel, I'm really sorry this is going to take even longer. But it's good to do for the club, and I'm proud to have it published.

If this situation changes, I'll let you know.

Jeff

Jeff A said:

Manuel, I'm really sorry this is going to take even longer. But it's good to do for the club, and I'm proud to have it published.

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That's cool - for the most part, I'm guessing we're figuring this to be one of our "off season" projects. Once its published on NSX-Driver, then we can sort out getting DIY / other versions online. Speaking for myself, a "lag" is perfectly acceptable -- its not like I can get to this for another few months, anyway

My "hope" is to get some sort of GB going down the road, with hitches and trailers etc... maybe even bring back the "buggy balls" that I sent to Dali many moons ago

Trailering with the NSX is a neat fix for the problem of moving tools and tires to the track. The main concern I have are the legal and insurance considerations of towing with a car that is precluded from towing by factory recommendation. In the unfortunate situation of an accident, coverage could be denied or liability incurred because of trailering with a vehicle that is not approved for towing by it's manufacturer.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer nor do I play a lawyer on TV.

Briank said:

Trailering with the NSX is a neat fix for the problem of moving tools and tires to the track. The main concern I have are the legal and insurance considerations of towing with a car that is precluded from towing by factory recommendation. ....

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I would be less concerned with the trailer aspect then I would be explaining to the insurance company what you were hauling. If it's a DOT legal trailer and a good hitch install, I don't see anything to worry about. But I'm not a lawyer, either.

t

Tank said:

I would be less concerned with the trailer aspect then I would be explaining to the insurance company what you were hauling. If it's a DOT legal trailer and a good hitch install, I don't see anything to worry about.

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What's wrong with carrying a coupe of "innocent" spare tires ??

I took a lot of pix of trailers and hitches at an Audi Club track event this weekend. Lots of cool little trailer alternatives.

Interestingly enough, most of the "tow vehicles" were all kinda small-ish cars too -- mostly Porsche 911 and Audi TT coupes. Chatting with the owners, they've been doing this for awhile, which leads me to believe we'll be just fine.

nsxtasy said:

The GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) of the 1991 NSX is 3550 pounds. So the capacity for occupants, luggage, and optional equipment, above the 3010 pound curb weight (weight with all standard equipment and full fluids), is 440 pounds....

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I don't mean to nitpick (and can hardly believe that no one pounced on this before ) but wouldn't that be 540 pounds (3550-3010=540)?

Your math looks right, but here's a picture of the label inside the driver's door

I was thinking that a hitch on the NSX to tow my other track car with would be cool. You know...an NSX towing an NSX....