And so it begins...the Quest for 200 in an NSX.

I had the magicians at SOS do some "enhancements" to my Zanardi (more on that in a forthcoming post. For now, let me say that I can't wipe the smile off my face.) While there, I took a few minutes to examine and admire the white wide body coupe that Chris and the crew have lovingly and continuously developed over the the past several years. I went home with my mind whirring, and began to formulate a plan...

As I have mentioned on Prime before, I recently took my Ford GT out to the Mojave event and did a 200+ speed run. This was a seminal moment for me as a car guy and I find myself bragging about it more often than is probably polite. My family and friends roll their eyes and change the subject whenever I bring it up.

I would like to see this speed in an NSX, and thus I have purchased the white SOS widebody with the intent of achieving this speed on the Bonneville Salt Flats this August. I'm not sure, but it may be the first time in history than an NSX has obtained this speed. Even it its not, I'm gonna give it shot (with the expert help of SOS).

From driving the GT, I learned that while it's easy to talk about going 200, actually doing it is another matter all together. I do not presume that it will be easy. Nor will it be cheap. It will require a full role cage and a parachute. Haven't told my wife that part yet.

If any of you have thoughts or ideas about this quest, I would like to hear them. While I have attended Speed Week and spent some time on the salt, I have never driven there at a sanctioned event. I'd like to hear from some of you who have, if you are out there. For that matter, I'd like to hear from any of you with high speed experience in the NSX. I've seen 160 (indicated) in mine, but that's a far cry from two hunert.

I'll begin a build thread once we get working. The plan is to go with the SOS twin Turbo system on a SOS built 3.0 liter. Target is about 500 hp. Our calculations seem to indicate that this will push the NSX past the magic 200. It will have to pull this speed at redline in Sixth.

The primary thoughts I've been having lately concern aerodynamics and efficiency at 200+ speeds.

Feedback appreciated.

Niceeeeee, nice collection of cars also

Welp, can't help you any from experience....but kudos to this very impressive undertaking

Good luck and be safe.

Awesome man!! Good Luck!
Unfort. I unable to help from a pure experience aspect as my best has been 170+ but this is a great undertaking.
Can't wait to see the forthcoming results

This is a fantastic undertaking. Kudos!

My only feedback would be Aero, Aero, and more Aero. Seems like a widebody would be counterproductive for straight-line speed?

Hi,

hope for the best and that you get there and even go over it :wink:

About my max speed....well... i ended the 5th on my NSX.... by math, it is 307km/h = 190mph
but it was in a empty Highway and in a slight downhill....

Good luck with the project.

Nuno

The Ruf "Yellow Bird" actually reverted to a stock width 911 body instead of the typical widebody. Everything was streamlined: from the driver's side rear view mirror to smoothing out body panels and removing the rain channels, to underbody panels and spoilers. Wheel widths were considered as well as body panel seams. If I remember correctly, it only had 470ish hp and still hit 211 mph. So...you can do this!

Kudos to you for undertaking the challenge. Really looking forward to seeing this project progress.

This should be an adventure!

Cody did 186 (300km/h) in our LoveFab car and it got there pretty quickly with 600whp.....I'm not sure what terminal velocity is, but it's likely gear-limited.

Brian

best of luck...i was eyeing the sos car for sale also...but you snooze ya loose...btw i'm no aerodynatomist...but I'm thinking the widebody might hinder rather than help your quest....I also think another member recently announced a plan to crack 200.

Looking forward to the continued developments and updates!
Huge Best of Luck on obtaining the magic 200 mph!

There seems to be little question, based on my somewhat basic research, that the wide body configuration is not ideal for a speed run. However, I would like to use the car for other events after the mission is accomplished (for example, track events) and the extra body width offers tire options that would not otherwise be available. Its like the rest of life; a compromise.

Having said that, it simply means that we will have to pay more attention to other areas, like underbody efficiency and the last refuge of all speed attempts: MORE POWER

This reminds me of a local guy that did this with his Enzo. I'm sure some of you have heard about this, but if you haven't.... http://www.roadandtrack.com/special-report/the-resurrection-of-the-enzo

Maybe you can get away with the widebody by minimizing the underbody air flow although you may need to it to produce some amount of downforce at speed.

Just thinking out loud...

Are you saying 500hp or 500rwhp?

DeHaldaswerth said:

I would like to see this speed in an NSX, and thus I have purchased the white SOS widebody with the intent of achieving this speed on the Bonneville Salt Flats this August. I'm not sure, but it may be the first time in history than an NSX has obtained this speed.

Click to expand...

Congrats, you have a great collection of NSXs- a late model Targa, a collector's piece, and a highly modded one! Why didn't you buy the 3.5 engine with the car and twin turbo that?

Will you be updating the build in this thread? Will you be coming out for practice sessions? I'd love to come out to meet you and see this at the flats.

Nero Tenebre said:

Congrats, you have a great collection of NSXs- a late model Targa, a collector's piece, and a highly modded one! Why didn't you buy the 3.5 engine with the car and twin turbo that?

Click to expand...

That monster requires race fuel. I needed the flexibility of pump gas for general usage after the speed mountain has been conquered.

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White92 said:

Will you be updating the build in this thread? Will you be coming out for practice sessions? I'd love to come out to meet you and see this at the flats.

Click to expand...

Yes and yes.

Ah good thinking then!

Awesome - I look forward to following your progress!

If 270 hp are enough to push a stock NA1 5-speed to168 mph (manufacturer specs), then something like 460 hp should be enough to get you to 200 in similar conditions. (200/168 = a 19% increase in top speed. The horsepower needed to overcome wind resistance goes up with the cube of the speed increase. Forgetting about the rolling resistance of the tires, transmission losses, etc. for a moment, if all of the crank horsepower were used to overcome wind resistance, a 1.19^3 = 69% increase in horsepower, so 270*1.69 = 457 crank hp would be needed to push you to 200 mph).

As has been mentioned by several others, if the widebody has more aerodynamic drag than the standard bodywork, you’ll probably need more than 457 crank hp to reach 200 mph. I wonder who really knows how much more drag the widebody bodywork creates. With 500 crank hp you’d still have a “cushion” of excess horsepower just in case. You should probably stay away from a big rear wing, though. Even the relatively modest 2002 NSX-R rear wing increased the car’s drag by 7% compared to the base model according to Honda.

Up high on the salt flats at Bonneville the air will be thinner than down at sea level. That may reduce the horsepower your engine produces (at least it would if it were naturally aspirated) but since it will reduce wind resistance by the same amount, that shouldn’t negatively impact top speed.

What may reduce the top speed is if the rolling resistance of the tires is higher on salt than on concrete or if the tires slip so much on the salt that you run into the rev limiter. A stock six-speed gearbox and stock final drive ratio give you 205 mph at 8000 rpm if there is no tire slip, no tire wear, etc. Supposedly that gives you 202 mph on concrete in real world conditions. If your tires have a higher amount of slip than on concrete, you will run into the rev limiter blow 202 mph. To hit 200 on salt, you may need to think about getting longer gearing or raising the rev limiter.

Do you know what class you are shooting for? There are quite a few found here.

greenberet said:

Awesome - I look forward to following your progress!

If 270 hp are enough to push a stock NA1 5-speed to168 mph (manufacturer specs), then something like 460 hp should be enough to get you to 200 in similar conditions. (200/168 = a 19% increase in top speed. The horsepower needed to overcome wind resistance goes up with the cube of the speed increase. Forgetting about the rolling resistance of the tires, transmission losses, etc. for a moment, if all of the crank horsepower were used to overcome wind resistance, a 1.19^3 = 69% increase in horsepower, so 270*1.69 = 457 crank hp would be needed to push you to 200 mph).

As has been mentioned by several others, if the widebody has more aerodynamic drag than the standard bodywork, you’ll probably need more than 457 crank hp to reach 200 mph. I wonder who really knows how much more drag the widebody bodywork creates. With 500 crank hp you’d still have a “cushion” of excess horsepower just in case. You should probably stay away from a big rear wing, though. Even the relatively modest 2002 NSX-R rear wing increased the car’s drag by 7% compared to the base model according to Honda.

Up high on the salt flats at Bonneville the air will be thinner than down at sea level. That may reduce the horsepower your engine produces (at least it would if it were naturally aspirated) but since it will reduce wind resistance by the same amount, that shouldn’t negatively impact top speed.

What may reduce the top speed is if the rolling resistance of the tires is higher on salt than on concrete or if the tires slip so much on the salt that you run into the rev limiter. A stock six-speed gearbox and stock final drive ratio give you 205 mph at 8000 rpm if there is no tire slip, no tire wear, etc. Supposedly that gives you 202 mph on concrete in real world conditions. If your tires have a higher amount of slip than on concrete, you will run into the rev limiter blow 202 mph. To hit 200 on salt, you may need to think about getting longer gearing or raising the rev limiter.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the helpful information and observations. The fact that I will be running on salt certainly changes the dynamics of the attempt. As to gearing, another way to tinker with that element is to alter the diameter of the rear tires. The fine tuning of the aero, both over and under body, will be a real challenge.

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White92 said:

Do you know what class you are shooting for? There are quite a few found here.

Click to expand...

From what I can translate, it seems that it will be Modified Sport, Blown Gas (MSBG?) engine class F. I'm just learning all of this myself

oooo this is exciting.

More than once, I've been asked if I've ever "maxed her out."
I usually link those asking to Greenberets 300kph video, then they get the point.

200mph is insane. Can't wait to see where this goes.

I went out to the Salt Flats in late summer and took a few pics. A favorite of the 458

^^^

That pic is INSANE!

Did I mention I'm subscribed?