Prospeed rdx injectors & ecu rom tune kit

I gave this mod a shot and was happy with my results. In addition to getting the RDX injectors and Stage 3 chip installed, I had Prospeed come out and tune it.
After the initial install of just the injectors and chip, I immediately noticed gain on the low end as others have observed which culminated at 18hp@4000rpm and much more torquer feel; however, the top end was struggling and showed no gain and the AFR's were still not ideal although improved with the Stage 3 chip. After having Brian fly out to tune it, the top end experienced gains as well that culminated at 20hp@7000rpm and improved torque significantly. The top end issues were attributed to altitude after discussing the results with Brian and the local tune shop and were straightened out by the tune.

My 92 NSX has 48K, all testing was done on a Dynojet at 5550ft altitude and results are SAE adjusted. Note: Threads on here indicate a power loss effect at my elevation due to altitude at about 15-20% loss (3% per 1000ft) of its sea level power.

Before:
Intake: Downforce Air Intake Scoop
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Dali Super Hot Chip
Injectors: OEM
Peak HP: 239
Peak Torque: 187

After: (dyno below)
Intake: Prospeed Cold Air Intake
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Stage 3 Chip w/Prospeed custom tune
Injectors: RDX
Peak HP: 252
Peak Torque: 192
note: ambient temp in garage was 93 during testing

Conclusion:
Most noticeable gains in comparing dynos from the initial install of injectors + chip and the following tune + CAI later on were: 18 hp at 4000 rpm, 20 hp at 7000 rpm, a range of 10-20 ft-lbs of torque throughout and improved AFR's. My gas mileage has stayed about the same from what I can tell...definitely not less. If you plan to stay NA, compared to purchasing an AEM EMS + tune vs. keeping the OEM ECU + Prospeed tune, for the same performance outcome I figured to be about $1K in savings. Prospeed acquired more information from this tune at altitude in which other high altitude owners can benefit from. I'm sure Brian would be happy to expound if you just inquire. I would like to thank L_RAO for pushing this through so the rest of Prime's early model owners could benefit and The Dyno Edge for their incredible hospitality during dyno rental. I would recommend this kit and a custom tune by Brian just to get every last bit out of it which was overall a great experience!

vf2ss said:

I gave this mod a shot and was happy with my results. In addition to getting the RDX injectors and Stage 3 chip installed, I had Prospeed come out and tune it.
After the initial install of just the injectors and chip, I immediately noticed gain on the low end as others have observed which culminated at 18hp@4000rpm and much more torquer feel; however, the top end was struggling and showed no gain and the AFR's were still not ideal although improved with the Stage 3 chip. After having Brian fly out to tune it, the top end experienced gains as well that culminated at 20hp@7000rpm and improved torque significantly. The top end issues were attributed to altitude after discussing the results with Brian and the local tune shop and were straightened out by the tune.

My 92 NSX has 48K, all testing was done on a Dynojet at 5550ft altitude and results are SAE adjusted. Note: Threads on here indicate a power loss effect at my elevation due to altitude at about 15-20% loss (3% per 1000ft) of its sea level power.

Before:
Intake: Downforce Air Intake Scoop
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Dali Super Hot Chip
Injectors: OEM
Peak HP: 239
Peak Torque: 187

After: (dyno below)
Intake: Prospeed Cold Air Intake
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Stage 3 Chip w/Prospeed custom tune
Injectors: RDX
Peak HP: 252
Peak Torque: 192
note: ambient temp in garage was 93 during testing

Conclusion:
Most noticeable gains in comparing dynos from the initial install of injectors + chip and the following tune + CAI later on were: 18 hp at 4000 rpm, 20 hp at 7000 rpm, a range of 10-20 ft-lbs of torque throughout and improved AFR's. My gas mileage has stayed about the same from what I can tell...definitely not less. If you plan to stay NA, compared to purchasing an AEM EMS + tune vs. keeping the OEM ECU + Prospeed tune, for the same performance outcome I figured to be about $1K in savings. Prospeed acquired more information from this tune at altitude in which other high altitude owners can benefit from. I'm sure Brian would be happy to expound if you just inquire. I would like to thank L_RAO for pushing this through so the rest of Prime's early model owners could benefit and The Dyno Edge for their incredible hospitality during dyno rental. I would recommend this kit and a custom tune by Brian just to get every last bit out of it which was overall a great experience!

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excellent write up!!! hopefully there's one avail. for the NA2 soon.

Yeah hopefully. Don't know why anyone in SoCal would be waiting for this no brainer mod but it's taking forever. Thought you SoCal boys were supposed to be leading the pack in the modding game.

Nero Tenebre said:

Yeah hopefully. Don't know why anyone in SoCal would be waiting for this no brainer mod but it's taking forever. Thought you SoCal boys were supposed to be leading the pack in the modding game.

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There's no good, solid information out there about OBD2 options. Yes I know you need either AEM EMS or AEM FIC, but we need some info on how much those complicate the process vs. shipping your OBD1 ECU to Prospeed for a ROM flash.

It doesn't really complicate it, you just need to buy and install the equipment. I think the FIC is a piggyback so you maintain the stock ECU, whereas the full EMS is more complicated to tune. If someone local with an obdii would just go over there, then prospeed would come up with a base tune from that data. I am waiting on some prices for installation and tuning, as I may go ahead and order it BUT it would be preferable to get it with a base map otherwise you are dead in the water as soon as the injectors are installed. Which means they need to be installed at a tuning shop and then the FIC also needs to be tuned there.

Nero Tenebre said:

It doesn't really complicate it, you just need to buy and install the equipment. I think the FIC is a piggyback so you maintain the stock ECU, whereas the full EMS is more complicated to tune. If someone local with an obdii would just go over there, then prospeed would come up with a base tune from that data. I am waiting on some prices for installation and tuning, as I may go ahead and order it BUT it would be preferable to get it with a base map otherwise you are dead in the water as soon as the injectors are installed. Which means they need to be installed at a tuning shop and then the FIC also needs to be tuned there.

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Right and I'd hope that the FIC can be tuned to allow the car to pass smog right? Brian?

I am sure it would pass smog, the car is still NA and you are just using larger oem injectors with better fuel atomization and efficiency. Not changing much... But someone else would have to confirm.

wahsaihin said:

excellent write up!!! hopefully there's one avail. for the NA2 soon.

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As I've stated a few times earlier in this thread, I'm the NA2 Guinea Pig for all of us. I expect Brian and I will move forward on this in Aug/Sept. We're waiting until I get some other mods completed this month.

9doors said:

As I've stated a few times earlier in this thread, I'm the NA2 Guinea Pig for all of us. I expect Brian and I will move forward on this in Aug/Sept. We're waiting until I get some other mods completed this month.

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Cool, I guess you will be providing the ODB2 3.2L base map.

I'm in NorCal but could be convinced to drive my car down to SoCal for the creation of ODB2 3.0L map sometime in the fall.

9doors said:

As I've stated a few times earlier in this thread, I'm the NA2 Guinea Pig for all of us. I expect Brian and I will move forward on this in Aug/Sept. We're waiting until I get some other mods completed this month.

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Are you going w/ full standalone AEM or piggy back FIC? Thx

enkrypt3d said:

Are you going w/ full standalone AEM or piggy back FIC? Thx

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Piggy back FIC. Need to pass smog.

9doors said:

Piggy back FIC. Need to pass smog.

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I'm waiting to hear how your experience is before I do this to mine.... hurry up! Lol :biggrin:

Why RDX injectors? Isn't there a Denso injector that is a direct drop in replacement that doesn't require harness adapters?

For 3.2L engines, aren't an FIC and injectors already a solution? Again, why use RDX injectors?

For the 3.0L engines, the injectors that are being replaced are kinda old. Has anyone ever tested or even wondered whether the reason these new injectors give more performance is simply because they are replacing older, possibly semi-clogged injectors? Perhaps just installing new OEM injectors will provide added performance?

All of the above are honest questions, not just bashing this product. :smile:

My main question is why choose injectors that aren't even direct replacements as the base for this kit?

J

02#154 said:

Why RDX injectors? Isn't there a Denso injector that is a direct drop in replacement that doesn't require harness adapters?

For 3.2L engines, aren't an FIC and injectors already a solution? Again, why use RDX injectors?

For the 3.0L engines, the injectors that are being replaced are kinda old. Has anyone ever tested or even wondered whether the reason these new injectors give more performance is simply because they are replacing older, possibly semi-clogged injectors? Perhaps just installing new OEM injectors will provide added performance?

All of the above are honest questions, not just bashing this product. :smile:

My main question is why choose injectors that aren't even direct replacements as the base for this kit?

J

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James, one of the suggested benefits of the newer RDX injectors is the superior spray pattern/atomization.

Hopefully *someone* ponies up for the dyno time for our F/IC OBDII friends!

RYU said:

James, one of the suggested benefits of the newer RDX injectors is the superior spray pattern/atomization.

Hopefully *someone* ponies up for the dyno time for our F/IC OBDII friends!

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If I read through the thread correctly, I think Brian at Prospeed pasted text from the Denso website that said something along the lines of all newer Denso injectors use the new spray technologies.

Yes, here is the page from where the text was copied: http://www.densoaftermarket.com/fuel-injector.php

"One of the true innovators in electronic fuel injection technology, DENSO introduced the 12-hole injector in 1999. Its breakthrough design reduced fuel droplet size to 65 microns, providing superior atomization for improved engine efficiency. In 2002, DENSO followed with its UC injector, reducing droplet size even further, down to 50 microns – around one-half the width of a human hair. That same world-class engineering expertise goes into DENSO's entire line of First Time Fit® fuel injectors."



J

02#154 said:

If I read through the thread correctly, I think Brian at Prospeed pasted text from the Denso website that said something along the lines of all newer Denso injectors use the new spray technologies.

Yes, here is the page from where the text was copied: http://www.densoaftermarket.com/fuel-injector.php

"One of the true innovators in electronic fuel injection technology, DENSO introduced the 12-hole injector in 1999. Its breakthrough design reduced fuel droplet size to 65 microns, providing superior atomization for improved engine efficiency. In 2002, DENSO followed with its UC injector, reducing droplet size even further, down to 50 microns – around one-half the width of a human hair. That same world-class engineering expertise goes into DENSO's entire line of First Time Fit® fuel injectors."



J

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One of the main reason we use the RDX injectors is because of the cost. It is one of the best bang for the buck injectors on the market. The size of the injector is also ideal for stock to extreme NA mods as well with a proper tune. In a perfect world they will have a direct replacement for the NSX but I haven't found it yet. =)

It isn't so difficult or expensive with the current kit we have now. The kit is plug and play and most primers on here have installed their own injectors with great success.

Interesting, I wonder if you have a graph comparing the Stage 3 tune and Custom Tune.

I am thinking of doing this mod but don't know rather I should go for a custom tune. From my understanding, Brain developed the stage 3 chip in Socal, so it should be more ideal for me to just go for the stage 3 than custom since I am in Socal too, without having different altitude problem. Am I correct?

Do you feel any hesitation during half throttle acceleration?

Thanks,
Hugo

vf2ss said:

I gave this mod a shot and was happy with my results. In addition to getting the RDX injectors and Stage 3 chip installed, I had Prospeed come out and tune it.
After the initial install of just the injectors and chip, I immediately noticed gain on the low end as others have observed which culminated at 18hp@4000rpm and much more torquer feel; however, the top end was struggling and showed no gain and the AFR's were still not ideal although improved with the Stage 3 chip. After having Brian fly out to tune it, the top end experienced gains as well that culminated at 20hp@7000rpm and improved torque significantly. The top end issues were attributed to altitude after discussing the results with Brian and the local tune shop and were straightened out by the tune.

My 92 NSX has 48K, all testing was done on a Dynojet at 5550ft altitude and results are SAE adjusted. Note: Threads on here indicate a power loss effect at my elevation due to altitude at about 15-20% loss (3% per 1000ft) of its sea level power.

Before:
Intake: Downforce Air Intake Scoop
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Dali Super Hot Chip
Injectors: OEM
Peak HP: 239
Peak Torque: 187

After: (dyno below)
Intake: Prospeed Cold Air Intake
Headers: OEM 97+
Exhaust: Taitec GTLW
ECU: Stage 3 Chip w/Prospeed custom tune
Injectors: RDX
Peak HP: 252
Peak Torque: 192
note: ambient temp in garage was 93 during testing

Conclusion:
Most noticeable gains in comparing dynos from the initial install of injectors + chip and the following tune + CAI later on were: 18 hp at 4000 rpm, 20 hp at 7000 rpm, a range of 10-20 ft-lbs of torque throughout and improved AFR's. My gas mileage has stayed about the same from what I can tell...definitely not less. If you plan to stay NA, compared to purchasing an AEM EMS + tune vs. keeping the OEM ECU + Prospeed tune, for the same performance outcome I figured to be about $1K in savings. Prospeed acquired more information from this tune at altitude in which other high altitude owners can benefit from. I'm sure Brian would be happy to expound if you just inquire. I would like to thank L_RAO for pushing this through so the rest of Prime's early model owners could benefit and The Dyno Edge for their incredible hospitality during dyno rental. I would recommend this kit and a custom tune by Brian just to get every last bit out of it which was overall a great experience!

Click to expand...

Brian,

I pm'd you about shipping. Please give me a call.

Does anyone know where to buy the boomslang harness?

Nero Tenebre said:

Brian,

I pm'd you about shipping. Please give me a call.

Does anyone know where to buy the boomslang harness?

Click to expand...

www.boomslang.us

HGL1668 said:

Interesting, I wonder if you have a graph comparing the Stage 3 tune and Custom Tune.

I am thinking of doing this mod but don't know rather I should go for a custom tune. From my understanding, Brain developed the stage 3 chip in Socal, so it should be more ideal for me to just go for the stage 3 than custom since I am in Socal too, without having different altitude problem. Am I correct?

Do you feel any hesitation during half throttle acceleration?

Thanks,
Hugo

Click to expand...

regarding the differences i can explain it pretty quick, when i put in the stage 3 chip + rdx injectors, compared to the dali chip, there was no improvement in max hp. the noticeable improvement was only the low end, specifically 18hp@4000rpm, safer afr's compared to the dali chip, and improved torque response.

after reviewing other dynos on this thread, there should have been an improvement on top as well which became the main reason i felt a custom tune was necessary. my understanding if you look at my afr's (the red line) on my dyno in post #376 (before brian's tune but with the prepped stage 3 chip and rdx injectors in), you can see that the chip, although prepped with my mods, my altitude and prospeed's calculations, still resulted in my afr's literally falling off the charts which directly correlates with why there was no improved power up top. this was the altitude issue i had alluded to earlier that brian obviously straightened out by the blue line dyno.

my guess is that since you are local, once brian takes in account your mods, sea level status, and preps your stage 3 accordingly, you would not have results like my initial outcome. however, since every na nsx is different, albeit very little perhaps, since you live right there i would consider it if your after-install dyno leaves you suspecting there is still more untapped power and/or if you can compare to other dynos with similar mods. if so, it will be worth it to squeeze everything you can out of it and brian will give you super safe afr's in the process.

you asked about half-throttle accel. there is zero hesitation on any part of throttle acceleration that i can feel. it's quite the opposite, the car is so jumpy torque-y it has improved launches without even trying and has very smooth steady power all the way through the powerband. the comment in other posts that vtec feels like it kicks in harder really does feel that way with the added torque and hp relative to where each of us respectively were before.

one thing i would like to add that i am very pleased about is that the increased torque all throughout really affected the long, usdm 2nd gear but in a good way...i mean a great way! the lag that we often complain about out of a turn has been noticeably reduced. the throttle's torquer response along with the measureable improved torque makes the usdm 2nd gear not as bad after all. i said "as" bad, not "so" bad as i still can only imagine how much funner it would be if i one day installed the jdm gears : )

9doors said:

As I've stated a few times earlier in this thread, I'm the NA2 Guinea Pig for all of us. I expect Brian and I will move forward on this in Aug/Sept. We're waiting until I get some other mods completed this month.

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Sorry Prime. I've reconsidered this and won't be doing this mod at this time. My apologies for not being able to supply the NA2 test data for you all.

9doors said:

Sorry Prime. I've reconsidered this and won't be doing this mod at this time. My apologies for not being able to supply the NA2 test data for you all.

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Sorry to hear that bud!


I've been busy developing and testing new products in the works... keep your eyes peeled guys. I am also working on an improved RDX spec program... a REV.2 if you will that will improve throttle response even more and with a revised VTEC changeover and slight improvements in the mid range... It's being tested first before being offered to the public. Once completed I will offer a free upgrade for previous Prospeed RDX spec ecu owners. =)

I've been busy developing and testing new products in the works... keep your eyes peeled guys. I am also working on an improved RDX spec program... a REV.2 if you will that will improve throttle response even more and with a revised VTEC changeover and slight improvements in the mid range... It's being tested first before being offered to the public. Once completed I will offer a free upgrade for previous Prospeed RDX spec ecu owners. =)

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And that is precisely why we love you. Its a great mod now, make it better and be (secretly) dancing in the streets.

Talk about Value-Added...Thx Brian:biggrin: Looking forward to it.
so its gonna be lighter, stronger, and faster....!!

So, I don't remember if I saw the discussion on this, but is a newer/stronger fuel pump needed to run this setup effectively, or is the stock one okay?

thanks in advance.