Note re: Forced Induction session at NSXPO

[Lud]

The format for the forced induction technical event has changed from the "panel discussion" format I discussed here previously.

The event will be a "roundtable discussion" for club members who own or are interested in forced induction. This will be an informal event.

We'll set up a few tables in the room and if we know there is an owner who is willing to participate, we'll make a sign and put it on the table or the wall behind the table that says "Comptech SC" or "Basch SC" or "Factor X Turbo" or "Gerry Johnson Turbo" or whatever. Then other owners who want to come compare notes can sit down at that table and chat away. Likewise, people who are "shopping" and want to talk to owners of those systems can come over to that table and listen in and ask questions. People can also move around to various tables as they see fit.

We will develop at least a handout outlining some of the issues people should consider when shopping. We may also include a quick explanation of some other basic concepts like HP vs. torque, area under the curve vs. peak HP, general characteristics of the different supercharger designs (roots, twin screw, centrifugal, etc.), probably as a handout. We will try to go over most of this at the beginning, then let people break out into discussion groups and get as technical as they like and discuss whatever is of interest.

No vendors will be in the room at any point during this session. They will be available at their vendor booths and throughout the rest of the event for anyone interested in discussing things directly with a vendor.

P.S. For anyone interested in dynoing their car, I believe Factor X is planning to have their Dynapack setup at NSXPO.

 

[NetViper]

That sounds awesome!! I wish i could go

 

[Arshad]

Lud would it be possible to make that handout available to those of us that are not able to attend the show this year?

 

[Juice]

Lud would it be possible to make that handout available to those of us that are not able to attend the show this year?

Ditto.

 

[ncdogdoc]

Lud,

What do you do if you have a BBSC, CTSC, and BellTT? I cannot be at three tables at once

 

[ANYTIME]

For anyone interested in dynoing their car, I believe Factor X is planning to have their Dynapack setup at NSXPO.

I am planning to have FactorX dyno my 2000 CTSC 6lb. NSX. This would be a great time to compare other FI kits that are dyno'ed on the same day, weather and most importantly, the same dyno. Why? Comptech results on my car were 339 to the rear wheels. Nice, huh? BottleBlownRacing(a local shop near me) results were 280 to the rear wheels. Same car, dramatic differences in HP. If we can get some of the other vendors to dyno their cars, then we can have results that are all comparable with one another.

See you at NSXPO!
John

 

[D'Ecosse]

So, how does one get signed up for a dyno???
Why would Factor X want to dyno a competitive product, unless they knew they had clear advantage in that the results would flatter their prodcut preferentially? Doesn't really make marketing sense & I wouldn't blame them if they didn't want to venture down that road.

Also, I'm not sure about prohibiting the vendors from the round-table - they are the experts (hopefully!) and their opinions surely valuable. W/o them I see members generally just either bitching or bragging about their own particular experience (or lack of). I say generally because there are clearly some very FI savvy members on this forum but I would have though that even they would be more stimulated by the presence of the vendors. I do recognize some vendors are represented in their own booths, but not all have such a venue.

 

[KGP]

So, how does one get signed up for a dyno???
Why would Factor X want to dyno a competitive product, unless they knew they had clear advantage in that the results would flatter their prodcut preferentially?

Good question! Not to answer for FactorX, but I have a bit of insight why they think this is important. Their Dynapack measures quite differently than most any other Dyno. So, if you were comparing FI solutions, wouldn't you want meaured gains coming by way of an apples to apples comparison? As FX pointed out to me during my recent visit, their FX turbo car measured on a dyno right up the street from them produced far greater power increase numbers than when measured on their dynapack. As I understand it, the Dynapack units are much more expensive, yet produce/display lesser power numbers than say a Dynojet or simplar equipment. So, if each FI manufacture wants to "talk," then this will be their opportunity to back-up that "talk" with apples to apples measurements, and under the exact same conditions. Just look at what anytime writes:

Comptech results on my car were 339 to the rear wheels. Nice, huh? BottleBlownRacing(a local shop near me) results were 280 to the rear wheels. Same car, dramatic differences in HP.

Becasue the results come from different dyno's he can't really draw any conclusion. If the results came from the same dyno, on the same day, you can start to draw some conclusions.

I for one applaud their effort and look forward to the results.

 

[BadCarma]

Lud, sounds like a good plan.thank you for all the behind the scenes work you do for the community.

I am unable to attend NSXPO, but still have a request and agenda. could you for the sake of all us nitrous folks have a single table that all the N20 guys can compare notes and theory,hash out some tech issues like all the S/C and Turbo guys.I feel that our ranks should be respected as a viable F/I option with enough club members using it to warrant a round table for the nitrous crowd,and hopefully it could educate some folks that have misconceptions about it's use.I would be very grateful.

 

[sjs]

Lud,

What do you do if you have a BBSC, CTSC, and BellTT? ...

Count yout blessings!

 

[Lud]

Arshad - Yes

ncdogdoc - The open discussion session will run for pretty much as long as people are interesting in sitting around and talking, so you should have time to "make the rounds"

D'Ecosse - Dyno signup will be announced at the event I assume. As for why they are doing it (1) I don't think it's free (2) Any decent turbo DOES look very good on a dyno sheet (3) I believe they were thinking along the lines of KGP's response in the value of having same-day, same-dyno runs for comparison. As for vendors, I understand your point and it has been considered, but this is the format we are using and that I personally feel it is the best possible format. If a vendor decided not to get a booth, that is their business and that decision was made before there was any discussion of having them in a forced induction panel discussion so they are not losing anything. They will still be available throughout the event for anyone interested in talking to them.

BadCarma - I was thinking about that. I am on the fence about including it in this seminar. I think it would be valuable, but that it should have it's own seminar. There is too little common ground, to the point where it would require a different set of handouts. I also believe few people shop nitrous vs. turbo/superchargers - they generally want nitrous or they want a turbo/supercharger. Show of hands - how many people would want to add nitrous to the list? How many nitrous cars will be there?

 

[Factor X Motorsports]

First off we would like to thank Lud for spear heading this FI seminar. More and more NSXs are being modified and the crowd has definitely swelled over the past few years. If the panel of “experts” does occur great, we would be more than happy to participate. If not we will be available to chat anytime during the event or at happy hour

We are currently working out the details with Infineon for the Dynapacks. As part of our sponsorship to the NSXCA, we are donating 10 free dynapack sessions. The individuals that bid the highest or win the raffle???, will qualify for the sessions. Outside of the sponsorship pulls we will be offering dynapack sessions at a reduced rate. A portion of the money raised will be donated to nsxprime.

Why are we bringing the Dynapacks?

Our primary business at Factor X is engine building and tuning. We are using the NSXPO as an opportunity to educate the market on all aspects of tuning. (engine management, fueling, equipment) In addition to the Dynapacks we will be bringing our Turbo System. As Anytime and KGP mentioned, dynos vary greatly. The only way to get a true comparison is to have them all run on the same dyno, at the same location, and time. Also, as KGP mentioned in our experience the Dynapacks tend to read lower than most other dynos. At our previous facility we had a Dynojet 248c, during our relocation we decided to upgrade to the Dynapacks for a number of reasons. One of which was safety, we have had a few of our vehicles break loose on the dyno or break straps but I guess that can happen at 1000+hp

Our booth will be located near the winners circle, if anyone has any questions, time to kill, or are just curious about tuning, engine building, and FI feel free to stop by. We look forward to meeting all of you face to face.

 

[tunapie]

I would not miss this for the world, but what day and time is this going to happen. Dan

 

[ajnsx]

report!

please give us a report after nsxpo for us kids outside the 'states. Ta. I'm still undecided on what supercharger to get. This would help greatly (as would factoring in brand of headers etc)

Side note; headers/extractors the same thing? In Oz we refer to them as extractors.

 

[CiaoBoy]

The format for the forced induction technical event has changed from the "panel discussion" format I discussed here previously.

The event will be a "roundtable discussion" for club members who own or are interested in forced induction. This will be an informal event.

We'll set up a few tables in the room and if we know there is an owner who is willing to participate, we'll make a sign and put it on the table or the wall behind the table that says "Comptech SC" or "Basch SC" or "Factor X Turbo" or "Gerry Johnson Turbo" or whatever. Then other owners who want to come compare notes can sit down at that table and chat away. Likewise, people who are "shopping" and want to talk to owners of those systems can come over to that table and listen in and ask questions. People can also move around to various tables as they see fit.

I would have preferred the panel discussion for several reasons:

1. I can hear all the information being presented, rather than miss out on the dialogue at 4 out of the 5 tables where I'm not at.

2. Owners will not have to repeat answers over and over because somebody new has just come over from another table and asks an old question.

3. A panel would allow the different offerers to pit themselves against their competition, hopefully giving a more directly comparable view of all the available options rather than a single view from one table which is hard to compare to claims made at another table.

4. A panel discussion would be addressing the whole audience, and whatever claims they make will be witnessed by the whole audience and they would be more likely to be true.

-Chris

 

[Factor X Motorsports]

We will be charging $60 for 3 pulls on the Dynapacks. As mentioned before a portion of the proceeds will go to the support of nsxprime.com. A sign up sheet will be available on Fri. We offer the use of our Dynapacks to all NSX owners and any after market manufacturer for the NSX. This is a great opportunity for all the NSX "tuners" out there to showcase their stuff